Author: Bob Durrett
Date: 08:05:39 11/27/03
Go up one level in this thread
On November 27, 2003 at 10:27:53, Terry McCracken wrote: >On November 27, 2003 at 09:24:35, Bob Durrett wrote: > >>On November 27, 2003 at 08:37:47, stuart taylor wrote: >> >>>On November 27, 2003 at 08:25:42, Terry McCracken wrote: >>> >>>>On November 27, 2003 at 04:36:20, ALI MIRAFZALI wrote: >>>> >>>>>On November 27, 2003 at 03:06:02, Kurt Utzinger wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On November 27, 2003 at 02:59:36, Gerald Wright wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>The Top players in the computer chess championship are all capable of drawing or >>>>>>>winning a match vs Kasparov or them in the top 10. >>>>>> >>>>>> As long as 2200 ELO players can get a lot of draws >>>>>> with safe and boring playing style the best comp >>>>>> programs do not have more than 2400 Elo. >>>>>> Kurt >>>>>What you are saying Kurt does not make sense at all.A 2400 elo player could >>>>>not draw Kasaprov under any circumstances.Please check the definition of ELO. >>>>>Also your claim of 2200 Elo players getting draws is Contrary to my own private >>>>>testing of many many games against 2200 Elo players. >>>> >>>> >>>>Playing computers are _not_ the same as playing Kasparov or _humans_ whatsoever. >>>>It is often easy to draw machines as Kurt suggests, winning is far more >>>>difficult, unless of course you obtain a large "book" advantage, with the White >>>>pieces. >>>> >>>>I've have found different ways to neuter computers, and so have many here who >>>>buy programmes to play against. It's still even quite possible to bring them >>>>down with carefully played K-Side attacks. By the time the comp sees it, it's >>>>too late. >>> >>> >>>In MY experience, it's not enough to do something before the computer realizes >>>it, but that it is VERY CAREFULLY played and worked out, also! >>> I've often got into positions where I think there could be a brilliant winning >>>attack esp. kingside, but don't know exactly which one way will do it, if there >>>IS one way. >>>I often try, but it's usually not that one way, or at any rate, atleast one of >>>the moves I make is not according to it. >>>S.Taylor >> >>There is a way to produce a score sheet, of a game with a chess engine, where >>the human wins. Simply play a game. Then go back to the first mistake and make >>another move. Repeat this process as many times as is necessary to get the >>desired result. This may not work every time, but it should improve the odds in >>favor of the Human. Of course, when you publish the scoresheet, it's best to >>conveniently forget to mention the take-backs. : ) >> >>Although this procedure may look bogus and like "cheating," it may be a good way >>to find the weaknesses in the chess-playing program. The final scoresheet >>should be useful to the engine programmer [and maybe to the opening book maker.] >> I advocate doing this for the sake of improving chess engines. >> >>Bob D. >> >>Bob D. > >Suggesting I'm cheating, even in fun, isn't funny! > >Edward, myself, and many others have beaten these beasts without cheating or >takebacks. That is truly wonderful, Terry. I wish I could say that, although I have not even tried. I'm sure that the engine programmers would love to get their hands on your wins against their programs. In fact, you could really "do good" by identifying the key positions in those games, where the program went astray, and then post those positions here for the various CCC programmers to look at. People here are constantly posting positions which present unexpected problems for the engines. In fact, I have one ready to post as soon as all this WCCC excitement dies down. Best wishes, Bob D. > >I can't help it if many CC Fans _can't_ play chess for the life of them. >Maybe that's why they buy programmes and ooohhh and aaahhh while watching >engines play the game! > >Other just use them to cheat against players like me at ICC and other chess >servers, to try and embarrass people who _actually_ play the damn game!!
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