Author: Mike Byrne
Date: 08:15:37 01/11/04
Go up one level in this thread
On January 11, 2004 at 10:28:29, Uri Blass wrote: >On January 11, 2004 at 09:08:55, Mike Byrne wrote: > >>On January 11, 2004 at 02:46:18, Uri Blass wrote: >> >>>On January 11, 2004 at 00:07:22, Mike Byrne wrote: >>> >>>>On January 10, 2004 at 20:23:32, Bob Durrett wrote: >>>> >>>>>On January 10, 2004 at 18:29:20, Mike Byrne wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On January 10, 2004 at 17:47:25, Drexel,Michael wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>On January 10, 2004 at 17:22:53, Kurt Utzinger wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>On January 10, 2004 at 15:29:16, David Dahlem wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>White to move and draw. Which engines can find it? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>[D]3B4/1r2p3/r2p1p2/bkp1P1p1/1p1P1PPp/p1P1K2P/PPB5/8 w - - 0 1 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. f5 1/2-1/2 >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>Regards >>>>>>>>>Dave >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Crafty_1908 WB2: (P4 1.8/32 MB hash) >>>>>>>> 3 00:00 -4.04 1. c4+ Kxc4 2. Bd3+ Kd5 3. Bxa6 cxd4+ 4. Kd3 >>>>>>>> 4 00:00 -4.01 1. c4+ Kxc4 2. Bd3+ Kd5 3. Bxa6 cxd4+ 4. Kd3 Ra7 >>>>>>>> 4 00:00 -3.64 1. Ba4+!! >>>>>>>> 4 00:00 0.00 1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. >>>>>>>>f5 >>>>>>>> 5 00:00 0.00 1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. >>>>>>>>f5 Rba7 >>>>>>>> 6 00:00 0.00 1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. >>>>>>>>f5 Rba7 7. Kf3 >>>>>>>> 7 00:01 0.00 1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. >>>>>>>>f5 Rba7 7. Kf3 Rc6 >>>>>>>> 8 00:01 0.00 1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. >>>>>>>>f5 Rba7 7. Kf3 Rc6 8. Ke4 >>>>>>>> 9 00:01 0.00 1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. >>>>>>>>f5 Rba7 7. Kf3 Rc6 8. Ke4 Rb6 >>>>>>>>10 00:03 0.00 1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. >>>>>>>>f5 Rba7 7. Kf3 Rc6 8. Ke4 Rb6 9. Kf3 >>>>>>>>11 00:08 0.00 1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. >>>>>>>>f5 Rba7 7. Kf3 Rc6 8. Ke4 Rb6 9. Kf3 Rc6 >>>>>>>>12 00:11 0.00 1. Ba4+ Kxa4 2. b3+ Kb5 3. c4+ Kc6 4. d5+ Kd7 5. e6+ Kxd8 6. >>>>>>>>f5 Rba7 7. Kf3 Rc6 8. Ke4 Rb6 9. Kf3 Rc6 >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Interesting. Crafty 19.06 can't find 1.Ba4+. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Michael >>>>>>> >>>>>>>New game >>>>>>>3B4/1r2p3/r2p1p2/bkp1P1p1/1p1P1PPp/p1P1K2P/PPB5/8 w - - 0 1 >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Analysis by Crafty 19.06: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Bxa6 cxd4+ >>>>>>> -+ (-4.45) Depth: 1/18 00:00:00 >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Bxa6 cxd4+ >>>>>>> -+ (-4.45) Depth: 1/18 00:00:00 >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Bxa6 cxd4+ >>>>>>> -+ (-4.45) Depth: 2/18 00:00:00 >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Bxa6 cxd4+ >>>>>>> -+ (-4.45) Depth: 2/18 00:00:00 >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Bxa6 cxd4+ >>>>>>> -+ (-4.45) Depth: 2/18 00:00:00 >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Bxa6 cxd4+ 4.Kd3 >>>>>>> -+ (-4.28) Depth: 3/19 00:00:00 >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Bxa6 cxd4+ 4.Kd3 Ra7 >>>>>>> -+ (-4.25) Depth: 4/19 00:00:00 >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Be4+ Ke6 4.f5+ Kd7 5.Bxb7 axb2 6.Bxa6 b1Q 7.Bxa5 dxe5 >>>>>>>8.dxc5 Qxa2 >>>>>>> -+ (-5.36) Depth: 5/23 00:00:00 >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Be4+ Ke6 4.f5+ Kd7 5.Bxb7 axb2 6.Bxa6 b1Q 7.Bxa5 dxe5 >>>>>>>8.dxc5 Qxa2 >>>>>>> -+ (-5.36) Depth: 6/24 00:00:00 392kN >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Be4+ Ke6 4.f5+ Kd7 5.Bxb7 axb2 6.Bxa6 b1Q 7.Bxa5 dxe5 >>>>>>>8.dxc5 Qxa2 >>>>>>> -+ (-5.36) Depth: 7/26 00:00:01 806kN >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Be4+ Ke6 4.Bxb7 gxf4+ 5.Kxf4 dxe5+ 6.dxe5 Ra7 7.Bxa5 >>>>>>>axb2 8.Bc8+ Kd5 9.Bb6 b1Q 10.Bxa7 Qxa2 >>>>>>> -+ (-5.73) Depth: 8/27 00:00:04 2236kN >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Be4+ Ke6 4.f5+ Kd7 5.Bxb7 cxd4+ 6.Kxd4 dxe5+ 7.Kc5 Ra7 >>>>>>>8.bxa3 Bxd8 9.Bc6+ Kc7 10.axb4 Rxa2 >>>>>>> -+ (-6.00) Depth: 9/28 00:00:08 5405kN >>>>>>>1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Bd3+ Kd5 3.Be4+ Ke6 4.f5+ Kf7 5.Bxb7 axb2 6.Bxa6 b1Q 7.Bxa5 Qxa2 >>>>>>>8.e6+ Kf8 9.Bb6 Qxa6 10.dxc5 dxc5 11.Bxc5 >>>>>>> -+ (-6.55) Depth: 10/30 00:00:31 21256kN >>>>>> >>>>>>It becomes a block pawn position, so when crafty is compiled with /DDETECTDRAW, >>>>>>it will find it. >>>>> >>>>>Would somebody who is familiar with Crafty's /DDETECTDRAW code please tell >>>>>everybody WHY is works [in plain English, please]? What is special about that >>>>>code which almost every other chess programmer has failed to put into his/her >>>>>engines? What does that code do [other than produce the correct move] which is >>>>>unique? >>>>> >>>>>Bob D. >>>> >>>>A picture is worth a thousand words, play the best moves for the above position >>>>and take a look at the ending position. >>>> >>>>[d]3k4/1r2p3/r2pPp2/b1pP1Pp1/1pP3Pp/pP2K2P/P7/8 b - - 0 6 >>>> >>>>the code simply identifies a locked position where the K is safely behind bars >>>>(pawns) , i.e., the game must be drawn. >>> >>>The question is if it does not detect draw in wrong cases(for example if black >>>has a queen instead of a bishop. >>> >>>Uri >> >> >>New game >>3k4/1r2p3/r2pPp2/q1pP1Pp1/1pP3Pp/pP2K2P/P7/8 b - - 0 1 >> >>Analysis by Crafty 19.08 SE: >> >>6...Qa4 7.bxa4 b3 8.axb3 Rxb3+ 9.Ke4 Rxh3 10.a5 Rxa5 >> -+ (-23.39) Depth: 8 00:00:00 101kN >>6...Qa4 >> -+ (-23.79) Depth: 9 00:00:00 112kN >>6...Qa4 7.bxa4 b3 8.axb3 Rxb3+ 9.Ke4 Rxh3 10.a5 Rh1 11.Kd3 Rxa5 >> -+ (-23.89) Depth: 9 00:00:00 114kN >>6...Qa4 7.bxa4 b3 8.axb3 Rxb3+ 9.Ke4 Rxh3 10.a5 Rh1 11.Kd3 Rxa5 >> -+ (-23.89) Depth: 9 00:00:00 255kN >>6...Qa4 7.bxa4 b3 8.axb3 Rxb3+ 9.Ke4 Rxh3 10.a5 Rh1 11.Kf3 Rxa5 >> -+ (-23.99) Depth: 10 00:00:00 285kN >>6...Qa4 7.bxa4 b3 8.axb3 Rxb3+ 9.Ke4 Rxh3 10.a5 Rh1 11.Kf3 Rxa5 >> -+ (-23.99) Depth: 10 00:00:01 566kN >>6...Qa4 >> -+ (-24.39) Depth: 11 00:00:01 573kN >>6...Qa4 7.bxa4 b3 8.axb3 Rxb3+ 9.Kf2 Rab6 10.Ke2 Rb2+ 11.Kf3 R6b3+ 12.Ke4 Re2# >> -+ (-#7) Depth: 11 00:00:11 6025kN >>6...Qa4 7.bxa4 b3 8.axb3 Rxb3+ 9.Kf2 Rab6 10.Ke2 Rb2+ 11.Kf3 R6b3+ 12.Ke4 Re2# >> -+ (-#7) Depth: 11 00:00:13 7559kN >>6...Qa4 7.bxa4 b3 8.axb3 Rxb3+ 9.Kf2 Rab6 10.Ke2 Rb2+ 11.Kf3 R6b3+ 12.Ke4 Re2# >> -+ (-#7) Depth: 12 00:00:50 27457kN >> >>(Byrne, Secane, PA USA 11.01.2004) >> >>not in this case ..you put any type of piece (Queen, light square bishop or >>knight) that can a force a win and it will see it > >Of course it is going to see it by search but the question was about static >evaluation. > >You give only analysis at big depth and not at depth 1. > >Uri it needs 3 plies to in search tos ee that it bust through the locked pawns --- that is how chess programs work ..search and evaluation ..not just one simple static score at sd 1..
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