Author: Drexel,Michael
Date: 08:55:18 01/15/04
Go up one level in this thread
On January 15, 2004 at 11:53:11, Drexel,Michael wrote: >On January 15, 2004 at 10:26:37, Mike Hood wrote: > >>On January 15, 2004 at 07:56:05, Drexel,Michael wrote: >> >>>On January 15, 2004 at 07:41:22, Mike Hood wrote: >>> >>>>On January 15, 2004 at 04:17:34, Drexel,Michael wrote: >>>> >>>>>On January 14, 2004 at 18:57:50, Mike Hood wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On January 14, 2004 at 16:08:24, David H. McClain wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>On January 14, 2004 at 15:07:39, Chris Taylor wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Does S8 know how to use the 6 piece egtbs'? I could wait for it to arrive, nah; >>>>>>>>please tell me! I have ordered the dam things and would like to know if I have >>>>>>>>wasted my GBPs. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Chris >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Chris, >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Being an amatuer here perhaps I am making an incorrect assumption about this. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>When I use my Shredder 7.04 the heavy hard drive activity appears to indicate it >>>>>>>is accessing EGTBs tablebases when there are six pieces left on the board. I >>>>>>>have assumed all along that this indicates that Shredder 7.04 is using a few of >>>>>>>my 6 piece EGTBs or is at least looking for them. Shredder Classic GUI also >>>>>>>states "6 piece EGTBs found" when changing hash table size for them. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Hopefully one of our experts on this can either confirm or refute this. If this >>>>>>>is in fact true then I see no reason why S 8 would not do the same. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>DHM >>>>>> >>>>>>The disk activity (and the "tb=" info in the engine window) when 6 pieces are on >>>>>>the board doesn't necessarily mean that Shredder 7 is accessing a 6-piece >>>>>>tablebase. It might only be accessing 5-piece tablebases in a search line which >>>>>>results in the capture of one of the pieces. >>>>>> >>>>>>As far as I know, Shredder 7 accesses the single part 6-piece tablebases, ie the >>>>>>tablebases that don't have a digit in the filename. The only programs that I >>>>>>know that access the multi-part 6-piece tablebases are Hiarcs 9 and Crafty. I >>>>>>assume that Shredder 8 can be added to this list. Ask me again next week. >>>>> >>>>>You can add Fritz 7 and Fritz 8 to that list. >>>>> >>>>>Michael >>>> >>>>Sorry, Michael, you're wrong. >>> >>>No, I am right. Both Fritz 7 and Fritz 8 use them in the search. >>> >>>New game >>>3kr3/8/8/8/8/3p4/2PP4/2RK4 w - - 0 1 >>> >>>Analysis by Fritz 7: >>> >>>1. = (0.00): 1.Ta1 dxc2+ 2.Kxc2 Te2 3.Ta7 Te1 >>>2. = (0.00): 1.Tb1 dxc2+ 2.Kxc2 Te2 >>>3. = (0.00): 1.cxd3 Te5 2.d4 Td5 >>>4. -+ (-#28): 1.c3 Th8 2.Ke1 >>>5. -+ (-#21): 1.c4 Tg8 2.Ke1 >>> >>> >>>New game >>>3kr3/8/8/8/8/3p4/2PP4/2RK4 w - - 0 1 >>> >>>Analysis by Fritz 8: >>> >>>1. = (0.00): 1.cxd3 Kd7 >>>2. = (0.00): 1.Ta1 dxc2+ 2.Kxc2 >>>3. = (0.00): 1.Tb1 dxc2+ 2.Kxc2 >>>4. -+ (-#27): 1.c3 Tg8 2.Ke1 Tg1+ 3.Kf2 Txc1 4.Ke3 Te1+ 5.Kd4 Te2 6.Kxd3 >>>5. -+ (-#21): 1.c4 Th8 2.Ke1 Th1+ 3.Kf2 Txc1 4.Ke3 Txc4 5.Kxd3 Tc1 6.Kd4 >>> >>> >>>This is what you get if an engine does not use them: >>> >>>New game >>>3kr3/8/8/8/8/3p4/2PP4/2RK4 w - - 0 1 >>> >>>Analysis by Fritz 6: >>> >>>1. ± (1.38): 1.cxd3 Kd7 2.Tc5 Kd6 3.Ta5 Kc6 4.d4 Te4 5.d5+ Kb6 >>>2. = (0.00): 1.Tb1 dxc2+ 2.Kxc2 >>>3. = (0.00): 1.Ta1 dxc2+ 2.Kxc2 >>>4. -+ (-#27): 1.c3 Th8 2.Ke1 Th1+ 3.Kf2 Txc1 4.Ke3 Te1+ 5.Kd4 Te2 >>>5. -+ (-#21): 1.c4 Th8 2.Ke1 Th1+ 3.Kf2 Txc1 4.Ke3 Txc4 >>> >>>Michael >> >>Michael, these analyses don't prove anything. When you analyse parallel lines, >>Fritz doesn't display the "tb=" info which is needed for proof. Also, in order >>to carry out the test you need to remove all the 5-piece, 4-piece and 3-piece >>tablebases before starting Fritz. I can guarantee you that the Fritz 7 and Fritz >>8 engines (Fritz 8.0.0.23) don't access multi-part tablebases. However, Fritz 7 >>and Fritz 8 do access single-part 6-piece tablebases. > >The tb info is no proof at all. It is also not needed for a proof. Just look at >the evaluation. >If Fritz 7 don't access multi-part tablebases please explain this: > >[D] 8/7k/6rq/8/8/7Q/6PP/6KR w - - 0 9 > >tbtest >8/7k/6rq/8/8/7Q/6PP/6KR w - - 0 1 > >Analysis by Fritz 7: > >9.Dxh6+ Kg8 10.Dxg6+ Kh8 11.Df6+ Kh7 12.h4 Kg8 > +- (16.41) Depth: 5/13 00:00:00 6kN, tb=8 >9.Dxh6+! > +- (16.75) Depth: 6/10 00:00:00 6kN, tb=10 >9.Dxh6+! > +- (17.06) Depth: 7/13 00:00:00 14kN, tb=14 >9.Dxh6+! > +- (17.06) Depth: 7/13 00:00:00 14kN, tb=14 >9.Dxh6+! > +- (#41) Depth: 7/18 00:00:00 23kN, tb=21 >9.Dxh6+! > +- (#41) Depth: 7/18 00:00:00 28kN, tb=27 > >And explain me why Fritz 7 blunders its Qeen in this position: > >[D] 7k/8/6Q1/8/8/8/6PP/6KR w - - 0 11 > >7k/8/6Q1/8/8/8/6PP/6KR w - - 0 1 > >Analysis by Fritz 7: > >11.Dg8+ Kxg8 12.h4 Kg7 13.g4 > +- (#12) Depth: 7/15 00:00:00 31kN, tb=11 > >Michael Sorry, wrong diagram [D] 6rk/6r1/6Q1/8/8/8/6PP/6KR w - - 0 11 New game 6rk/6r1/6Q1/8/8/8/6PP/6KR w - - 0 1 Analysis by Fritz 7: 11.Dxg7+ Kxg7 +- (#40) Depth: 7/14 00:00:00 9kN, tb=8
This page took 0 seconds to execute
Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700
Current Computer Chess Club Forums at Talkchess. This site by Sean Mintz.