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Subject: Re: Gothmog -- just how strong is it?

Author: Dann Corbit

Date: 13:13:06 01/16/04

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On January 16, 2004 at 16:04:58, David H. McClain wrote:

>On January 16, 2004 at 15:36:31, Tord Romstad wrote:
>
>>On January 16, 2004 at 14:40:22, David H. McClain wrote:
>>
>>>It's a nice program.
>>
>>Thanks.
>>
>>>I have watched it play but someone needs to clarify whether you want to know
>>>its strength against "free" engines or whether they want to know its STRENGTH.
>>
>>I don't see why someone "needs to clarify" how its strength compares to the
>>commercial programs, but if you or anybody else want to find out, just go
>>ahead and test it.  It runs perfectly in Winboard, Arena, and all the
>>different Fritz-like interfaces from ChessBase.  Most people don't find it
>>very interesting to run matches between engines of so widely differing
>>strengths (I guesstimate the difference between my engine and the top
>>commercial to be somewhere between 200 and 400 points), but nobody is
>>going to complain or try to stop you if you, for whatever reason, want
>>to see such a match.
>>
>>It seems to me that you for some reason think games played at home
>>don't count, and that you need to play Gothmog on some chess server
>>to estimate its real strength.  The truth is rather the opposite.  The
>>version which plays on ICC is almost always more experimental and buggy
>>than the public version.
>>
>>And finally, if you wonder why I and many of the other amateur programmers
>>with accounts on ICC don't play commercials there:  There is no point for
>>us in doing so.  If we want to play Hiarcs or Shredder, we can do so at
>>home.  Doing so at a chess server is a waste of time.  Playing against
>>amateur engines operated by their authors is something entirely different.
>>If both programmers are present and follow the game, we chat, discuss
>>our latest improvements and ideas, explain to each other why our engines
>>evaluate a certain position in the game as advantageous or disadvantageous,
>>and so on.  It is much more interesting to chat with someone who knows
>>everything about the internal workings of the engine and can explain
>>what is going on, than with someone who has just bought a chess program
>>and installed it on his computer.
>>
>>I (and, I assume, all other amateur programmers on ICC) have nothing against
>>playing commercials.  But we want to play against *the author's own account*.
>>It would be fantastic if Mark Uniacke, Frans Morsch or Stefan Meyer-Kahlen
>>had their own accounts on the ICC and played there regularly.  I can
>>guarantee that we would all play them as aften as we could.
>>
>>Tord
>
>Well thank you Tord.  Now I see one must be a "professional" here to make a
>statement or ask a question.  I apologize for questioning a "professional." Just
>remember at one time you also were an amatuer and some ways maybe you still are.
>
>Perhaps an uncontrolled game would be just as interesting as floundering around
>hour after hour in a home test?  I am simply curious, perhaps you are not. I
>will not bother you again.

I am quite sure that you misunderstood TR.

Tord's position:
"He likes to play against accounts with a live author on the other end of the
pipe so he can chat"

Your position:
"Play against the professional programs."

The solution:
Download his engine and use Winboard, Arena, or something else to play against
the professional engines.

I saw nothing derogatory in his tone for you to take offense at.



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