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Subject: Re: Hydra stats on Playchess.

Author: Gerd Isenberg

Date: 11:48:43 02/17/04

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On February 17, 2004 at 14:02:01, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On February 17, 2004 at 13:48:16, Mark Young wrote:
>
>>Hydra
>>8 x 2.8 Xeon & 8 FPGA Cards
>>
>>Total games 47
>>Stored results 47
>>White 24
>>Wins 19
>>Draws 16
>>Losses 12
>>
>>Results 27/47 = 57.4%
>>Opponents Elo 2604
>>N Opponents 31
>>
>>Rating 2634
>>
>>I see nothing in the results or games to suggest at this time. That Hydra is the
>>end all, be all future of computer chess.
>>
>>The last game I saw Hydra playing Shredder 8 on a P600 and down a pawn when
>>Hydra logged off. TC was 15 10.
>>
>>Dispite the hype... Hydra is not exactly blowing the top PC programs out of the
>>water even on much slower hardware. If the results are correct on playchess.com
>>for Hydra.
>
>You have to learn that hyperbole follows any new project.  It is fast, and it
>plays pretty well.  But it isn't _that_ good.  IE It is not the second-coming of
>deep blue or some such nonsense.  I did a few runs on an 8-way opteron two weeks
>ago and saw speeds that were around 16-17M nodes per second.  Hydra's speed can
>already be reached by existing hardware, and without the issues of no hash in
>hardware, its speeds can be beaten with existing machines.
>
>IE the last version of Belle was first seen in 1980.  By 1983 Cray Blitz was
>out-searching it.  And we continued to get faster every year while Belle was
>stuck at the hardware speed it was built around.
>
>DB's 200M nodes per second average was incredible in 1997.  I've searched 10% of
>that speed already and there are boxes around that will go maybe 4x faster than
>that.  So today, it is possible to search about 1/2 as fast as deep blue, but
>with their hardware non-hashing problem, we might be faster today.
>
>Time marches on, hardware designs tend to be "flash in the pan" things,
>brilliant today, not so fast tomorrow, slow next year...

but even FPGAs became faster and more sophisticated the next years.
It's probably a bit more flexible/portable architecture than former solutions.

PCI(X)-bus is the bottleneck, so there is a tradeoff between PCI-bus
bandwith/latency and number of hashless FPGA-plies. May be it's even possible in
the future to do four(+quiescence) FPGA-plies with appropriate branching factor
and driving PCIX on the limit. Chrilly already implemented killer heuristics...

I believe they will domitate the scene for a few years.
But of course i may be wrong ;-)




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