Author: Uri Blass
Date: 11:00:25 03/01/04
Go up one level in this thread
On March 01, 2004 at 13:02:49, Drexel,Michael wrote:
>On March 01, 2004 at 10:56:02, Uri Blass wrote:
>
>>On March 01, 2004 at 10:42:28, Drexel,Michael wrote:
>>
>>>On March 01, 2004 at 10:27:54, Uri Blass wrote:
>>>
>>>>On March 01, 2004 at 10:19:53, Jorge Pichard wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Arena tournament
>>>>>
>>>>>Rank Engine Score Ba Mo S-B
>>>>>1 Movei00_8_174 17.0/30 · · · · 0011=1=110=1101110010010110===. 221.00
>>>>>2 Baron 1.2.0 13.0/30 1100=0=001=0010001101101001===· 221.00
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>30 games played / Tournament finished
>>>>>Tournament start: 2004.02.29, 20:16:36
>>>>>Latest update: 2004.03.01, 04:41:01
>>>>>Site/ Country: S0025128408, United States
>>>>>Level: Blitz 10/0
>>>>>Hardware: AMD Athlon(tm) Processor 1202 MHz
>>>>>Operating system: Microsoft Windows XP Build 2195
>>>>>PGN-File: C:\Program Files\Arena\Arena.pgn
>>>>>Table created with: Arena 1.03
>>>>
>>>>It seems that movei did not use book in these games and only played the first
>>>>move from its internal book that is not in an external file.
>>>>
>>>>There are 2 book files that should be used with movei if you want it to use
>>>>book.
>>>>
>>>>Not that I complain(people can test movei as they want) and I am not sure if
>>>>movei could do better with it's small books.
>>>>
>>>>Uri
>>>
>>>Movei does probably much worse with this "book".
>>>It shouldn't play 1.e4 without huge book because it does not know how to play a
>>>sicilian or french defence at all.
>>>
>>>Michael
>>
>>Note that with default setting after losing one game with 1.e4 movei learns to
>>play 1.d4 and it learns again to play 1.e4 after losing a game with 1.d4
>>
>>I have games from my beta testers when movei won with 1.e4 both against sicilian
>>and french(note that I still did not look at the games and maybe the opponents
>>also do not know how to play against movei's mistakes)
>>
>>I am not sure if movei's book was exactly the same as the public book in these
>>games but I am quite sure that my beta tester did not use a huge book.
>
>1.e4 e6 2.d4 c5 is not a French defence.
>It is a Franco Benoni or something like that.
>
>This is a French Defense:
>
>[Event "ATHLONXP, Blitz:5'+3""]
>[Site "ATHLONXP"]
>[Date "2004.02.29"]
>[Round "8"]
>[White "movei00_8_174"]
>[Black "Hiarcs 9"]
>[Result "0-1"]
>[ECO "C11"]
>[Annotator "0.17;0.12"]
>[PlyCount "104"]
>[TimeControl "300+3"]
>
>{W=9.6 ply; 358kN/s B=10.5 ply; 193kN/s} 1. d4 {0.01/1 0} d5 {0} 2. Nc3 {
>0.01/1 0} e6 {0} 3. e4 {0.17/10 20} Nf6 {0} 4. e5 {0.30/9 6} Nfd7 {0} 5. Nf3 {
>0.43/10 20} c5 {0} 6. Be3 {0.25/10 31} Nc6 {0} 7. Bb5 {0.41/10 9} cxd4 {0} 8.
>Bxd4 {0.26/10 11} Qc7 {(a6) 0.12/10 19} 9. O-O {-0.06/9 7} a6 {-0.33/10 7} 10.
>Bxc6 {-0.46/10 7} bxc6 {-0.14/11 12} 11. Be3 {(Sa4) -0.47/10 10} Nxe5 {
>-0.73/10 14} 12. Nxe5 {-0.49/9 6} Qxe5 {-0.73/10 9} 13. Bd4 {-0.61/10 24} Qf4 {
>(Dg5) -0.84/10 11} 14. Re1 {(Se2) -0.48/9 17} Bd6 {(f6) -1.17/10 9} 15. g3 {
>-0.72/10 9} Qg5 {-1.30/10 11} 16. h4 {-0.72/8 3} Qf5 {(Dg6) -1.48/10 11} 17.
>Bxg7 {(Dd3) -1.00/8 4} Rg8 {-2.11/10 10} 18. Qd4 {-1.90/10 13} c5 {-2.11/9 6}
>19. Qf6 {(Dxd5) -1.87/10 9} Qg4 {-1.49/9 8} 20. Nxd5 {-2.09/9 12} Bb7 {
>-1.66/9 10} 21. Qxe6+ {-2.03/9 14} fxe6 {(Dxe6) -1.77/11 6} 22. Nf6+ {
>-1.78/11 10} Ke7 {-1.73/12 9} 23. Nxg4 {-1.80/11 18} Rxg7 {-1.85/12 10} 24. Ne3
>{-1.74/10 6} Rf8 {-1.88/11 9} 25. Rad1 {-1.85/8 4} Bc7 {(Le5) -1.88/10 9} 26.
>c3 {(Td3) -1.63/8 5} Rf4 {(Tgf7) -1.98/9 9} 27. Re2 {-2.08/7 2} Kf8 {
>(Kf6) -1.96/9 9} 28. Ng2 {-1.82/10 12} Rf6 {-1.91/10 13} 29. Rde1 {-1.72/9 7}
>Bd5 {(e5) -1.95/10 10} 30. Ne3 {(b3) -1.71/9 3} Bxa2 {(Lf3) -1.86/11 9} 31. Ra1
>{-1.71/10 4} Bd5 {-1.93/11 7} 32. Rxa6 {-1.71/10 5} Bf3 {(Lb7) -1.91/10 7} 33.
>Re1 {-1.66/9 6} Rd7 {(Tgf7) -1.84/9 12} 34. Nc4 {-1.63/9 15} Bb7 {
>(Tdf7) -1.92/9 4} 35. Ra7 {-1.67/9 5} Bc6 {-1.96/9 7} 36. Ra6 {-1.57/10 20} Bb5
>{-2.38/10 4} 37. Ra8+ {-1.90/10 9} Kg7 {-2.25/11 10} 38. Na3 {(b3) -1.90/9 5}
>Bc6 {-2.59/10 7} 39. Ra7 {-1.79/8 2} Kg8 {(Kh8) -2.63/10 4} 40. Rf1 {-1.92/8 2}
>Rg6 {-2.72/10 8} 41. Ra6 {-2.14/10 7} Bb7 {-2.92/10 6} 42. Ra4 {-1.90/9 5} Rd2
>{(Td3) -3.06/10 6} 43. Rb1 {-2.58/10 15} Bxg3 {(Lc6) -6.13/11 13} 44. fxg3 {
>-2.29/9 3} Rxg3+ {-6.38/11 6} 45. Kf1 {0.01/1 0} Bf3 {-7.20/9 3} 46. Nc4 {
>-5.50/8 2} Rh2 {-7.06/10 8} 47. Ne5 {-5.95/8 4} Be2+ {-7.31/10 6} 48. Ke1 {
>0.01/1 0} Rg1+ {-7.40/9 5} 49. Kd2 {0.01/1 0} Rxb1 {-7.45/10 5} 50. Kc2 {
>-6.73/7 3} Rf1 {(Tg1) -7.62/10 5} 51. Ra8+ {-7.03/8 5} Kg7 {-7.62/11 5} 52. Kb3
>{-6.96/7 3} Rxh4 {-7.97/9 3} 0-1
>
>As you can see the game was decided in favour of black after a few moves.
As I can see the problem is mainly not superior positional understanding of
hiarcs but the fact that movei does not see deep enough.
Hiarcs also does not understand that it stands better even when it plays 8...Qc7
and both programs evaluate that the lack of developement of black is enough or
almost enough compensation for the fact that white is losing a pawn(see hiarcs
evaluation when it plays 10...bxc6 when it certainly can see by search winning a
pawn at that time).
Movei with deeper search can also play better(for example with more time it
finds 10.Ba4 that is better than 10.Bxc6)
Uri
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