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Subject: Re: Fine #70 and hash bug(s) (warning: long post)

Author: Dennis Breuker

Date: 02:59:09 04/19/04

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How big is your hash table? Could it be that it is too small,
and the important positions get overwritten since you
always replace? It could be that you replace positions with
a large subtree under it?!

Dennis

On April 18, 2004 at 19:56:25, Andrew Wagner wrote:

>     Ok, I've been banging my head against this one all day. This is Fine #70:
>[d]8/k7/3p4/p2P1p2/P2P1P2/8/8/K7 w - -
>
>     Below is Trueno's output for the position. Of course, the correct result is
>+1.8 (Trueno counts pawns as .9) with the best move of Kb1. It finds that but
>then changes its mind. I've been told that this position is generally infamous
>for catching hash bugs. Anyone have any suggestions how to attack this one? Null
>move is off, and I'm evaluating material only, using a single replace-always
>hash table. Any suggestions would be VERY much appreciated). Andrew
>
>           -------------------------------
>        8 | . | . | . | . | . | . | . | . |
>          |-------------------------------|
>        7 | k | . | . | . | . | . | . | . |
>          |-------------------------------|
>        6 | . | . | . | p | . | . | . | . |
>          |-------------------------------|
>        5 | p | . | . | P | . | p | . | . |
>          |-------------------------------|
>        4 | P | . | . | P | . | P | . | . |
>          |-------------------------------|
>        3 | . | . | . | . | . | . | . | . |
>          |-------------------------------|
>        2 | . | . | . | . | . | . | . | . |
>          |-------------------------------|
>        1 | K | . | . | . | . | . | . | . |
>           -------------------------------
>            A   B   C   D   E   F   G   H
>
>Fifty: 0  En Passant: 0
>Castle: 0000
>Ply: 0  To move: True
>
>
>1. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 4; PV: a1-b2
>2. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 15; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6
>3. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 48; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3
>4. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 111; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7
>5. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 231; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4
>6. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 408; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>7. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 671; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7 c4-d3
>8. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 1003; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7
>9. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 1443; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4
>10. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 1968; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7
>11. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 2735; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3
>12. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 3522; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7
>13. Score: .9; Time: 0; nodes: 4416; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4
>14. Score: .9; Time: 1; nodes: 5410; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7
>15. Score: .9; Time: 1; nodes: 6584; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3
>16. Score: .9; Time: 1; nodes: 7885; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7
>17. Score: .9; Time: 1; nodes: 9273; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4
>18. Score: .9; Time: 1; nodes: 10845; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-c7 c3-c4 c7-d7
>c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7
>19. Score: .9; Time: 1; nodes: 16249; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-b7 c3-c4 b7-b6
>c4-d3 b6-c7 d3-c4 c7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3
>20. Score: .9; Time: 1; nodes: 18816; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-b7 c3-c4 b7-b6
>c4-d3 b6-c7 d3-c4 c7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3 d7-e7 d3-c4 e7-d7 c4-d3
>d7-e7
>21. Score: 1.8; Time: 2; nodes: 30305; PV: a1-b1 a7-b6 b1-c2 b6-b7 c2-d2 b7-c7
>d2-d3 c7-b6 d3-e3 b6-c7 e3-f3 c7-d7 f3-g3 d7-e7 g3-h4 e7-f6 h4-h5 f6-f7 h5-g5
>f7-e8 g5-f5
>22. Score: 1.8; Time: 2; nodes: 40127; PV: a1-b1 a7-b6 b1-c2 b6-b7 c2-d2 b7-c7
>d2-d3 c7-b6 d3-e3 b6-c7 e3-f3 c7-d7 f3-g3 d7-e7 g3-h4 e7-f6 h4-h5 f6-f7 h5-g5
>f7-e8 g5-f5 e8-e7
>23. Score: 1.8; Time: 2; nodes: 50869; PV: a1-b1 a7-b6 b1-c2 b6-b7 c2-d2 b7-c7
>d2-d3 c7-b6 d3-e3 b6-c7 e3-f3 c7-d7 f3-g3 d7-e7 g3-h4 e7-f6 h4-h5 f6-f7 h5-g5
>f7-e8 g5-f5 e8-e7 f5-e4
>24. Score: 1.8; Time: 3; nodes: 64039; PV: a1-a2 a7-b6 a2-b3 b6-c7 b3-c3 c7-b6
>c3-c2 b6-a6 c2-d2 a6-b6 d2-e3 b6-c7 e3-f3 c7-d7 f3-g3 d7-e7 g3-h4 e7-f6 h4-h5
>f6-f7 h5-g5 f7-e8 g5-f5 e8-e7
>25. Score: 1.8; Time: 3; nodes: 75500; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-b7 c3-d2 b7-c7
>d2-d3 c7-b6 d3-e3 b6-c7 e3-f3 c7-d7 f3-g3 d7-e7 g3-h4 e7-f6 h4-h5 f6-f7 h5-g5
>f7-e8 g5-f5 e8-e7 f5-e4 e7-d7 e4-f5
>26. Score: 1.8; Time: 4; nodes: 83644; PV: a1-b2 a7-b6 b2-c3 b6-b7 c3-d2 b7-c7
>d2-d3 c7-b6 d3-e3 b6-c7 e3-f3 c7-d7 f3-g3 d7-e7 g3-h4 e7-f6 h4-h5 f6-f7 h5-g5
>f7-e8 g5-f5 e8-e7 f5-e4 e7-d7 e4-f5 d7-e7
>I play a1-b2
>Nodes: 83k; NPS: 21414; QNodes: 0; MO%: 98; FHA: 2; HC%: 55; Hash%: 58; NM%: 0;
>egtb hits: 0; Ext's: 0; Total time searched: 3.906
>
>(MO% = first-move fail-high percent; FHA isn't important; HC is the percent of
>time the hash move causes a cutoff; Hash% is the percent of time I find the move
>in the hash table; the rest is un-important)
>
>(told you it was a long post)



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