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Subject: Re: List of participants for WCCC

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 10:20:35 05/19/04

Go up one level in this thread


On May 19, 2004 at 12:19:05, Omid David Tabibi wrote:

>On May 19, 2004 at 11:56:37, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On May 19, 2004 at 03:38:52, Omid David Tabibi wrote:
>>
>>>On May 18, 2004 at 13:56:25, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>
>>>>On May 18, 2004 at 13:46:02, Omid David Tabibi wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I hope that makes it clear why _I_ have not said much about playing this year.
>>>>>>Who knows _what_ rule(s) the ICCA will use this time around.
>>>>>
>>>>>I know. And I have told you many times.
>>>>
>>>>That is _really_ convincing.  You guys don't even want to produce a list of who
>>>>is playing???
>>>
>>>Check the WCCC page today.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>Last time I looked _you_ didn't speak for the ICCA any more than the organizers
>>>>of the WCCC I tried to enter a couple of years back spoke for it.
>>>
>>>I don't know when or where you looked, or what happened in Paris or Jakarta that
>>>you frequently mention. What I know is about WCCC 2004, and I am telling you in
>>>the clearest possible way what will be the case here.
>>
>>
>>I'll run through this once more.  Slowly.
>>
>>In Jakarta, there was _no_ outside communication.  No game results.  No nothing.
>> Dead silence.
>>
>>In Paris, same deal.  No internet access.  No nothing.  I believe this was the
>>event where Thorsten was getting results out at his own expense via cell.
>>
>>Two of the first two WMCCC's I ever participated in.  While at every ACM and
>>WCCC event past 1980 we had outside world access.
>>
>>Then For one of the more recent events, and no, now I don't even remember which
>>because I no longer care, I made arrangements to get a pretty good box (8-way
>>from Dell) and when they finally worked out the details for me, I tried to enter
>>and was told "We have a new rule that says that a programmer _must_ attend."
>>Bruce Moreland went to this event and can confirm all of this as he and I talked
>>about it multiple times.  I then "undid" my machine arrangements, a bit
>>embarassing after having asked and having had some folks at Dell go out of the
>>way to help.  Later Bruce tells me that a commercial entry could not get the
>>programmer there and the ICCA decided to drop the rule.
>>
>>Doesn't that do wonders for my wanting to participate _again_??  Doesn't that
>>make me take what you say on behalf of the ICCA at something less than true face
>>value, since the rules get changed on a whim???
>>
>>That is my problem.  Later they _again_ modified this rule so that it became
>>possible to have a non-programmer operator, but at double the normal entry fee.
>>What is _that_ about?  This is an organization that wants to promote computer
>>chess or throttle it?  Is it all about the money going in to the ICCA?   Or is
>>it about the computer chess competition and interest in same?
>>
>>Looks _bad_ from my perspective.  And when the last CCT had what appears to be
>>over 5x the entries of the current WCCC event, and there is no cost, and there
>>are no changing entry rules, and so forth, what is the incentive to go to a WCCC
>>rather than the next CCT event?
>>
>>Hopefully you get my drift.
>>
>>I don't believe _any_ of this has put the ICCA in a particularly favorable
>>light.  I guess those of us that originally formed this organization can just
>>carry on feeling embarassed about how the tournaments have been handled the past
>>few years.  The journal is a good thing.  But the tournament (which was
>>originally the 'flagship' of the ICCA) has gone steadily downhill.
>>
>>How would _you_ react to such utter nonsense???
>>
>
>It seems that indeed some points where unclear in some of the previous WCCCs.
>But again, I am only responsible for the current WCCC. And I am doing my best to
>clarify the things as much as possible.

Yes you are.  But as I mentioned _YOU_ are not the ICGA.  Through at least 1992
or so, "we programmers" had a strong voice in what happened.  Somewhere around
1992-1995 things started to change however.


>
>
>
>>
>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>At the CCT we manage to have an _open_ discussion about the rules _before_ the
>>>>event, and then we go by those rules.  The ICCA might try that at some point in
>>>>time, perhaps???
>>>>
>>>>I'd love to play remotely.  Once it becomes obvious that doing so is "OK".
>>>
>>>We don't provide operators here. But if you send someone to operate Crafty on
>>>your behalf, that is OK.
>>
>>I have a volunteer that would do well.  I'll investigate hardware one more time.
>> But I can guarantee you that if the rules change this time, it will be my
>>absolute last time to try this...
>
>If you send an operator here, there will be no problem.



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