Author: Tony Werten
Date: 23:05:24 05/25/04
Go up one level in this thread
On May 25, 2004 at 14:11:09, Robert Hyatt wrote: >On May 25, 2004 at 13:48:40, Arturo Ochoa wrote: > >>On May 24, 2004 at 20:37:31, Robert Hyatt wrote: >> >>>On May 24, 2004 at 16:17:40, Arturo Ochoa wrote: >>> >>>>On May 24, 2004 at 16:10:11, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>> >>>>>On May 24, 2004 at 15:44:21, Arturo Ochoa wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>>>DIEP played two standard games against crafty yesterday on ICC with Vincent >>>>>>>>himself presiding (and pontificating). DIEP lost them both. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>I was wondering how long it would take for that information to make it >>>>>>>onto CCC. Took longer than I thought. :) >>>>>>> >>>>>>>-- >>>>>>>James >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>I agree. Considering how a big proportion of the posters of this Forum loves >>>>>>gossiping and spreading scandals, I missed that the information had not >>>>>>generated a big thread with all the garbage involved. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>You missed a _lot_ of garbage by not watching. Here is just a sample: >>>>> >>>>>Game 1: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: and my book is by the way at random >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: internet book + at random >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>... >>>>> >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: but rook endgame gotta be draw >>>>> >>>>>... >>>>> >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: a4 looks stupid >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: but perhaps it enough to win et's see >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: very stupid one >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: allows ra8 now >>>>> >>>>>(note for above crafty was white and played a4) >>>>> >>>>>... >>>>> >>>>>First game ended in Crafty winning. There were probably 500 kibitzes by >>>>>Vincent, mostly about random noise such as value of pawn in Hydra, etc... >>>>> >>>>>Game 2: >>>>> >>>>>The below is apparently rambling about upcoming WCCC... >>>>> >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: shredder is big favourite >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: shredder 60% chance >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: i'm guessing i have 20 >>>>> >>>>>... >>>>> >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: position looks = to me >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: so all my money on diep to win it :) >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: my nps is good now >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: 203k nps at 9 ply >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: cool >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: so i go win >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: +0.28 >>>>> >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: hyatt denies crafty advanced btw >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: because otherwise cray blitz can't beat it of course :) >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: cray blitz from 1994 and before ;) >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: of course losing a queen >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: in diep queen = 11.50 >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: rook = 5.8 >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: piece = 3.625 >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: and that's too little >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: i know most commercial programs like shredder >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: have piece = 4.2 >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: that won't work >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: for programs without huge mobility term >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: put it at >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: rook = 6.0 >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: piece = 4.0 >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: queen = 12.5 >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: pawn 1.000 here >>>>>Your opponent offers you a draw. >>>>>Use "draw" to accept. The offer is valid until you make a move. >>>>>Offer to draw declined. >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: perhaps it's contempt factor of crafty that avoids draw >>>>> >>>>>(Crafty thought it was better and declined the draw. It eventually was proven >>>>>to be the correct decision as it won). >>>>> >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: i have analyzed with world top 10 GM's several occasions >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: and they have no way to express what they think from a >>>>>position >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: they say the biggest crap >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: like >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: queen+knight is better than queen+bishop >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: such nonsense >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: this is Capablanca actually >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: then i ask GM >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: who also wrote about it >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: some English GM >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: and then he says >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: "but only when at 1 wing" >>>>>a >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: then i show him diep - jonny world champs 2003 >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: "but only when bishop not too strong" >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: "and knight very strong" >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: then i show him why diep won it >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: "but it is good here for white because diep has active >>>>>queen and safe king position" >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: their rules just suck ass >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: the average computerchess programmer knows 100x more >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: about evaluation >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: than any of those guys >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: simply because they are unable to formualte general rules >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: a general rule that works great for example is that a rook >>>>>is worth more than a knight >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: diep planning to lose now >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: c5???? >>>>> >>>>>... >>>>> >>>>>DIEP(C DM) kibitzes: oh dear i don't get my king in h1 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>At that point I decided to leave. I'd heard enough garbage for one afternoon... >>>>> >>>>>So yes, you missed a _lot_. :) >>>>> >>>>>I left out his ranting about me not accepting to play a $1000 match... >>>> >>>> >>>>Posting this, you are giving me the reason. You save all this chat session and >>>>you post it here. >>> >>>I started saving all the kibitzes/chan 64 tells a few weeks ago. Several people >>>kept telling me about all the nonsense I had missed when Vincent was last on. I >>>didn't really believe it was all _that_ bad until I started looking... >>> >>> >> >>I dont know but where I see you personal battle and yuur arguments. I could also >>write a Bible of nonsenses. So, I dont see your point. What do you mean? >> >> >>>> >>>>You belong to the big proportion that I was refering to. This is incredible >>>>coming from your person. >>> >>> >>>No idea what that means. You make statements, you get to stand by them and live >>>with them. I do... >>> >>> >> >>Well, that is not my work to explain you, neither I am willing to do it. If your >>work is to fill the Forum with scandales and gossip, you are in the average >>group of posters of this Forum. Nothing else. :) > >My "work" is to (a) defend myself against outright lies, which are only produced >by Vincent here with regard to me (of course he also attacks others, but I am >only talking about me here); (b) prevent such outrageous technically incorrect >statements made by him from being taken at face value; (c) tit-for-tat. He >likes to quote (or misquote actually) me all the time, I thought I would return >the favor, except that I quoted him _exactly_. Not via false versions of what >he says... I don't have a problem with a and b, it's the c that starts to annoy me. Do you really need to quote Vincent with this "look what he said about me here" stuff. I can understand your frustation/irritation, but I don't really like to read about it all over this place. Your opinion is clear and understood. It's just that I'm here mostly to read about computerchess, and not about 2 computerchess people. Tony > >If I am an "average poster" that at least puts me way above him, which is good >enough for the present... > > > > > > >> >> >>> >>> >>>> >>>>Well, that is what I should expect. Nothing else. Excellent, when the people >>>>point out the facts for me. You did not have to do it!
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