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Subject: Re: Iterative deepening -- Why add exactly one ply?

Author: Volker Böhm

Date: 15:41:53 05/27/04

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On May 27, 2004 at 11:59:43, Ed Schröder wrote:

>On May 26, 2004 at 13:34:23, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On May 26, 2004 at 12:30:33, Tord Romstad wrote:
>>
>>>On May 26, 2004 at 12:13:03, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>
>>>>On May 26, 2004 at 10:53:16, Stefano Gemma wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>I've used an recursive-iterative deepening. I try to explain in my poor english.
>>>>>At any N plyes i've applyed iterative deepening as for the root. Suppose to
>>>>>start with 2 plies. The next iterations you should search 4 then 6 then 8 plies
>>>>>etc, form the root. But, when you're searching 8 plies depth, and you are at a
>>>>>position located at ply 2, why don't use iterative deepening starting from ply
>>>>>2, instead to do a full search of the remaining 6 plies? So i've tried to
>>>>>consider positions at ply 2 (and 4 and 6...) as they were at the root, and start
>>>>>a search to ply 4, then 6, then 8. Sometimes works better, sometimes worse...
>>>>>
>>>>>I have tried different schemas, in Raffaela. The best seems the schema 2-4. You
>>>>>increment the iterative deepening by 2 plies (one chess move by colour) and, for
>>>>>any ply, you make an iterative deepening with increment 4. In some position, 2-2
>>>>>was better.
>>>>>
>>>>>I've abandoned this idea, for now, because i'm working on a new engine and i've
>>>>>little time for my hobby, but i think that could be interesting.
>>>>>
>>>>>Ciao!!!
>>>>>
>>>>>Stefano Gemma
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>That sounds like an interesting idea that is worth testing.  IE at _any_ ply
>>>>where you want to do a depth=N search, you iterate and do a depth=1, 2, ..., N
>>>>to work your way up to that point.  With luck the  depth 1 to n-1 searches will
>>>>be cheap with hash information, if there is none, move ordering will probably be
>>>>broken anyway and this might improve things.
>>>
>>>This is exactly what I always thought was called "internal iterative
>>>deepening", but I have recently learned that others use this term to refer
>>>to something different.
>>>
>>>I use something similar to Stefano's technique (if I understood it correctly)
>>>at all internal nodes where the remaining depth is high (currently 5 plies or
>>>more) and I expect a fail high.
>>>
>>>Tord
>
>>I have used "IID" for years, but in a very restricted way, namely to handle the
>>case along the PV where I have no hash move.  I've never tried it _everywhere_
>>before, so have no data.  But I intend to try to see if it is something that
>>could work, or if it is a waste...
>
>Try to use IID in another way. Actually I found 2 ways that perform better than
>the original IID idea.
>
>Preamble: RD = remaining depth
>          R  = reduction depth
>
>1) if (RD >= 3) search all moves with R=(RD-2)+(RD/2) then search all moves
>again with the full depth. The principle applies only once in an unsorted tree,
>thus is not recursive.
>
>2) if (RD >= 3) search a move with R=(RD-2)+(RD/2) and when finished research
>that move again with the full depth. The principle applies only once in an
>unsorted tree, thus is not recursive.
>
>I have tried RD>=2 too but found that normal move ordering is superior.
>
>Ed

Sorry if my question is silly.
For example with RD == 10 R gets (10-2) + (10 / 2) == 8 + 5 == 13. What to do
with "13"? It cannot be the new remaining depth and it cannot be R - 13 as this
is negative.
Is there a bug in the formular or do I miss something?

Thanks Volker



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