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Subject: Re: Kramnik considers Machine TOO WEAK !

Author: Daniel Jackson

Date: 00:40:03 06/22/04

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On June 21, 2004 at 19:36:29, Joachim Rang wrote:

>On June 21, 2004 at 19:15:11, John Merlino wrote:
>
>>On June 21, 2004 at 19:04:18, Joachim Rang wrote:
>>
>>>On June 21, 2004 at 17:47:34, Jorge Pichard wrote:
>>>
>>>>http://www.chessbase.com/newsdetail.asp?newsid=1718
>>>
>>>too weak for what? Why not quote the whole statement:
>>>
>>>Machines are too weak to reach the ground of chess and give a final answer to
>>>some unsolved questions in chess.
>>>
>>>One can only say, how true!
>>>
>>>regards Joachim
>>
>>Uh, that wasn't exactly what he said either.
>>
>>HERE is the whole quote, in the context of a portion of the full interview:
>>
>>------------------
>>Spiegel Online: Are you a genius?
>>
>>Kramnik: I am pretty talented.
>>
>>Spiegel Online: Once again so modest.
>>
>>Kramnik: You know, sometimes I think I have understood a position, but after a
>>couple of years I realize that I have understood nothing. That is what is so
>>mysterious and fascinating about chess. You have a board with 64 squares, and it
>>is so deep that not even ten Kramniks can know which is the best move. Sometimes
>>you simply feel lost. You cannot feel the ground.
>>
>>Spiegel Online: Are you afraid of the depth?
>>
>>Kramnik: It is sometimes painful. You simply cannot reach the ground. This
>>ground or call it final truth, if it exists at all, is not of humans.
>>
>>Spiegel Online: Will a machine ever be in a position to light up the darkness?
>>
>>Kramnik: I don’t think so. Not even the strongest computers even come close to
>>the ground.
>>
>>Spiegel Online: What does the machines lack?
>>
>>Kramnik: The strongest computer, against which I played in October 2002, can
>>examine four million positions per second. You can work out how many it plays
>>through in six or seven minutes but they are too weak.
>>
>>Spiegel Online: But you still say that man are superior to the computer.
>>
>>Kramnik: Because man has intuition. He has this untouchable moment within
>>himself. We may call it understanding.
>>------------------
>>
>>jm
>
>
>okay right, one might interprete differently. In my understanding he said, that
>computers are to weak to light up the darkness of chess understanding which one
>might describe as "solving" chess. It was not about OTB-Performance, where
>machined obviously are not weak but equal to the world class (and soon stronger
>probably).
>
>To give you an example:
>
>[D]8/8/p4Bp1/1pPb2P1/1P2kp2/P7/5K2/8 w - - 0 1
>
>which computer can light the darkness on that position and tell you that the
>only move to draw is c6? No computer can do it today, but man can (and could) do
>it.
>
>regards Joachim

For a human it's not to hard. The plan is to have the B control a5 and d8
sqaures protecting both Queen-Side and King-Side pawns and with excellet King
position for White, Black can't make progress.

Daniel



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