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Subject: Re: Crafty was lucky (nt)

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 19:46:15 07/14/04

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On July 14, 2004 at 07:53:07, Ed Schröder wrote:

>On July 14, 2004 at 01:50:03, Russell Reagan wrote:
>
>>On July 12, 2004 at 03:51:44, Ed Schröder wrote:
>>
>>>The question here is how Crafty being down a pawn, also facing 3 connected
>>>passers (h2,g2,f2) evaluates this position. Did 42..a5! show a possitive score
>>>for Crafty then hat off for Crafty. Did 42..a5! show a < -1.xx or even lower
>>>then I would say Crafty indeed was lucky.
>>
>>I look at it from a different perspective. Crafty was the better engine this
>>game. Dan Heisman says it better than I could.
>>
>>http://www.chesscafe.com/text/real.txt
>>
>>"A Chain is Only As Strong As Its Weakest Link
>>The best way to introduce the second part of my explanation is to
>>make an analogy. Suppose you build a home where the temperature
>>is -20 degrees outside. You decide on a one-room home with four
>>walls, a roof, a floor, and a heater. You decide to save a little time
>>and material by finishing the four walls, the floor, and half the roof,
>>but the other half you leave open. Even though you have completed
>>over 90% of the structure, the temperature inside your home will
>>still be about -20 degrees with half your roof open. If you want
>>your inside heater to be effective, you have to enclose all of your
>>home.
>>
>>The cold home analogy is similar to what happens when you play
>>Real chess for 90% of your moves, but not for the other 10%. You
>>think you are a good player, but weaker players beat you when you
>>let down your guard for that 10%. In order to be a good player, you
>>have to at least try to play correctly on every move, not just most of
>>them. Consistency is important: remember that your chain of
>>moves, in many cases, is only as strong as the weakest link."
>>
>>Crafty may have been outplayed for most of the game, but it was more consistent
>>than Falcon, so it ended up the better engine that game.
>
>
>I disagree with the comparison. In computer chess it sometimes happens a
>position being so full of dynamics both computers impossibly can't see (predict)
>the outcome neither by eval nor by search. In such a case luck moves in. I think
>42..a5! is such a case.

I don't see +any+ luck there.  It is simply the right move.  Any other black
move is pointless.  The point here is that after a5, white chose to
self-immolate with the Ra8 move, rather than getting his own pawns rolling.

So no luck for black, unless you count white's complete lack of understanding as
luck".

>
>It's like in soccer, 2 equal teams, the ball by one unfortunate clutch coming
>right for the foot of the opponent and BANG, you lose. Nobody is to blame.
>
>In human chess it is different, the human player can always be blamed for not
>seeing the strategic consequences. It's different with computer chess since
>strategic understanding hardly is to program and still is an unexplored area.
>
>To demonstrate my point, put the 42..a5! position in any program, let it think
>for 1 ply and I predict no program will report a plus score for black.
>



Yes, but what happens after you input the white reply to that move?
In this game, after Ra8, my score was almost zero after a few seconds.  White
apparently just didn't understand the endgame there.

That's not "luck".  It's a lack of skill...

Luck plays a part.  But playing the right moves so that your opponent has to
defend accurately is really not luck...



>My best,
>
>Ed



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