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Subject: Re: A test position for chess programs(counting attackers-defenders)

Author: Laurence Chen

Date: 07:44:31 01/14/99

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On January 14, 1999 at 10:12:44, blass uri wrote:

>
>On January 14, 1999 at 08:49:37, James T. Walker wrote:
>
>>On January 14, 1999 at 07:36:07, blass uri wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>5rk1/1B6/4p1pp/2b3p1/3qP3/6P1/1P2QPP1/5RK1 w - - 0 1
>>>
>>>This is a position from the game Junior5-FM Boris Mariasin(The result was draw)
>>>
>>>Junior5 and other programs evaluating it as an advantage fo white because they
>>>do not know to count Attackers-Defenders
>>>
>>>Is there a progam with a more realistic evaluation (small advantage for black or
>>>at least less than 0.2 pawn for white)?
>>>
>>>Uri
>>Hello Uri,
>>I'm a very bad chess player so I don't understand what is happening in this
>>position.  I see that white is up a pawn which is about a point.  So where is
>>the advantage for black?
>
>The advantage of black is that the black pieces attack f2 and all the white
>pieces must defend f2.
>
>White has no plan to do a progress in the position when black can play h5,g4,h4
>with an attack.
>
>I am not saying that black is winning but the evaluation should be at least
>equality.
>
>The problem of computers is that they do not count attacker-defemsors of f2 and
>cannot understand that the fact that white is passive give black at least
>equality
>
>Uri
Uri can you prove this position is equal? Really, you are saying that because of
the opposite color bishops in the position. Yet, let me ask you then, what can
Black do? Black is down a pawn, and White has a passed pawn on the Queenside,
that is why the +1.xx evaluation. So the position is not equal, the assessment
is correct, because White can break the pin of f2 easily, and if Black attempts
to advance the Kingside pawns, it gets in big trouble, it exposes the King to
White pieces. Remember there's enough material on board to mate, Queen, Rook and
Bishop. So what you are saying is not correct, because Black needs a good plan,
and I cannot see any for Black. Of course, if the Queens are exchanged then the
evaluation would be different. Then perhaps, equality would be more correct of
assessment. As long as the Queens are on board there's always trouble.



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