Author: Uri Blass
Date: 06:49:17 01/04/05
Go up one level in this thread
On January 04, 2005 at 06:36:51, George Tsavdaris wrote: >On January 04, 2005 at 03:10:00, Tony Nichols wrote: > >>On January 04, 2005 at 02:26:56, Uri Blass wrote: >> >>>On January 04, 2005 at 01:31:21, Jouni Uski wrote: >>> >>>>I don't mean copy, but strong as Ruffian 1.0.5 and source - this is sensation!! >>> >>>No sensation for me. >>> >>>I predicted before Fruit2 that Fruit will be better than shredder8 in 2007. >>> >>>The good results of Fabian only suggest that the top programs of today are weak >>>because the programmers who work about them are relatively not good programmers. >>> >>>As far as I know no programmer got good results like Fabian in a short time as >>>an amateur(Fabian started to write Fruit in 2003) and I guess that Fabian does >>>not live from chess programming and has another job. >>> >>>>BTW is it joke readme file: >>>> >>>>"Fruit is not fast (in nodes per second) given the little it is >>>>calculating." >>>> >>>>?? Peaks over 2Mnps on my 2 years old PC! >>>> >>>>Jouni >>> >>>I do not think that Fruit can search more than 2M nodes per second on 2 years >>>old PC. >>> >>>Fruit on my A3000 can calculate slightly less than 1 Mnp per second in the >>>opening position. >>> >>> >>>Uri >> >>Hello Uri, >> >> I always read your posts because I appreciate your rational point of view. >>However, I don't think your statement about programmers of top engines being >>poor programmers is justified or fair. While I'm happy that Fruit2 is performing >>so well at such an early stage in it's developement I don't forget other >>programs with similiar promise that hit the wall soon after. Maybe Fruit will go >>on to be the best program ever, But untill then the programmers of the top >>engines should be seen as the best. Don't you agree? > >Actually Uri hasn't said that Fruit will be the top program ever. He just said >that it will be better than Shredder 8 in 2007. He didn't say it will be better >than Shredder in 2007. And that's a huge difference since Shredder in 2007 will >have a version of 11 or something...... Yes and I do not expect it to be the best when Fabian always share his code so other can learn from it. Fabian still did not implement some important knowledge about king safety and there are ideas about better qsearch that he still did not try. I think that he used no secret ideas to the programmers of top programs except maybe history based pruning. I think that the secret of the success of fabian is simply having less bugs than his opponents. He said that he looked at games of fruit and correct the weaknesses with no problem. I think that the main problem is not to find the weakness but to correct them without bugs and it seems that the programmers of top programs simply fail in that task and a lot of commercial programs simply have bugs that were not fixed or they create new bugs. I can mention Fritz that changes in the evaluation caused it to play stupid sacrifices (for example against Diep in WCCC) Shredder was also weaker in WCCC because of bugs of stefan when he removed some code by accident. Junior has bugs for years when it can see mate in drawn position and inspite of the fact that Amir knows about the bug he did not fix it. Uri
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