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Subject: Re: Fruit 2 and endgame play

Author: Uri Blass

Date: 17:09:57 01/12/05

Go up one level in this thread


On January 12, 2005 at 19:51:12, chandler yergin wrote:

>On January 12, 2005 at 17:39:55, Uri Blass wrote:
>
>>On January 12, 2005 at 13:31:16, chandler yergin wrote:
>>
>>>On January 12, 2005 at 10:54:26, Anthony Cozzie wrote:
>>>
>>>>On January 12, 2005 at 02:33:38, Jouni Uski wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>In my (private) endgame testsuite Fruit scored better than some programs
>>>>>with tablebase support (e.g. Junior8 and Crafty).
>>>
>>>
>>>>Quite stunning - it seems,
>>>>>that excellent search depth compensates TBs!
>>>
>>> Your opinion.. Provide evidence!
>>>
>>> And my suite has some 5/6 piece
>>>>>positions were TB access is definitely advantage.
>>>>>
>>>>>Jouni
>>>>
>>>>IMO the 5-piece tablebases are just not that interesting and really not worth
>>>>that much in terms of elo.
>>>
>>>What are the Current ELO Ratings for Top Programs, including yours?
>>>
>>>THey represents exact play, and all positions possible are immediatly shown.
>>>What more can you expect?
>>>
>>>
>>>> A little endgame knowledge can cover most of the
>>>>positions and be a lot faster too.
>>>
>>>Absolute NONSENSE!
>>
>>Not nonsense.
>>
>>In most of the position of 5 pieces or less than it computers can find the right
>>move with no tablebases.
>>
>>Uri
>
>IN HOW MUCH TIME URI?

In most of the positions they have no problem to find the right move at
tournament time control and I think even in blitz there may be exceptions but if
you take random legal position they will win most positions that are possible to
win.

programs with the right knowledge with no tablebases can usually win KQ vs KR
or KQR vs KP endgames with no problem and some trivial positions like KQR vs KP
are part of the positions that program may get in games so I cannot ignore them
in the discussion.

program can draw most drawn KPP vs KP with no tablebases.

They may have problems in part of the positions of  KRP vs KR but tablebases
change nothing for most of the tablebases positions that they get in games.

Uri



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