Author: chandler yergin
Date: 17:55:04 01/12/05
Go up one level in this thread
On January 12, 2005 at 20:45:47, Dann Corbit wrote: >On January 12, 2005 at 20:32:35, chandler yergin wrote: > >>On January 12, 2005 at 20:30:56, Dann Corbit wrote: >> >>>On January 12, 2005 at 20:26:56, chandler yergin wrote: >>> >>>>On January 12, 2005 at 20:19:48, Dann Corbit wrote: >>>> >>>>>On January 12, 2005 at 20:04:27, chandler yergin wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On January 12, 2005 at 19:56:25, Dann Corbit wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>On January 12, 2005 at 19:37:29, Steve Maughan wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Dann, >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>Things that seem impossible quickly become possible. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>I recon about 300 years before a computer will solve chess. This assumes >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>1) 10^120 possible positions >>>>>>> >>>>>>>This is far, far too large. Chess positions have been encoded in 162 bits, >>>>>>>which puts an absolute upper limit at 10^58 (and it is probably much less than >>>>>>>that). >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>2) Alpha-beta cutting this down to 10^60 sensible positions >>>> >>>>The Question does NOT concern "sensible" positions.. It concerns ALL Possible >>>>positions! >>>>What don't you understand? >>>>>>> >>>>>>>The incorrect first assumption renders this and all following assumtions as >>>>>>>moot. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>It's NOT an "assumption!" >>>>>>THAT, is YOUR error! >>>>>> >>>>>>YOUR Ass-umptions that follow are ludicrouos! >>>>> >>>>>Not only is it demonstrably and obviously incorrect, the proper result is well >>>>>known and has been known for decades. >>>> >>>>CRAP! Stop your biased Opinion and REFUTE my Statement! >>> >>>I have already done it. You simply don't understand it. >>> >>>> Furthermore, no advanced mathematics are >>>>>needed to grasp it. A simple junior high level understanding should be >>>>>sufficient. >>>> >>>>Yeah.. well PROVE IT! >>> >>>Already done >>>Q.E.D. >> >> >>You'd like to think so... >>NOT SO! > >I will explain it so that you will very easily understand. Consider the game of >tic-tac-toe. > >There are 255,168 TTT games, and yet (modulo symmetries) there are only 765 >possible achievable positions. > >If (for each of those positions) I know what move I should make (any best move >will do) then I have solved the game. With a table of the 765 answers, whatever >move you make, I will make my answer move. > >See: >http://www.btinternet.com/~se16/hgb/tictactoe.htm > >Hence, the number of possible chess games is totally irrelevant. The only thing >that matters is the number of possible chess positions. Once I have computed my >oracle, I will know what to do no matter what the board looks like. > >It does not matter how many ways there are to achieve a position. I only have >to know what to do once I get there. > >[Event "Edited game"] >[Site "DCORBIT64"] >[Date "2005.01.12"] >[Round "-"] >[White "-"] >[Black "-"] >[Result "*"] > >1. Nc3 Nc6 2. Nb1 Nb8 3. Nc3 Nc6 4. Nb1 Nb8 5. Nc3 Nc6 6. Nb1 Nb8 7. Nc3 >Nc6 8. e3 e6 >* > >[Event "Edited game"] >[Site "DCORBIT64"] >[Date "2005.01.12"] >[Round "-"] >[White "-"] >[Black "-"] >[Result "*"] > >1. Nc3 Nc6 2. e3 e6 >* You Dare comparing CHESS to Tic tac Toe? Or a LINE? To Prove an Idiotic assumption? The Last resort of a Knave... Give it UP! you are Lost in Fantasy... and wishful thinking!
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