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Subject: Re: Engine ELO

Author: gerold daniels

Date: 06:24:29 01/30/05

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On January 30, 2005 at 01:32:56, Joshua Haglund wrote:

>I think chess engines should not be given an approximate rating. I think they
>should be given an ELO RANGE, and be ranked by the average of the ELO RANGE.
>There shouldn't be an engine on the list unless it has played more then 5000
>games. These games are consisting of different books, hardware, settings, etc.,
>hence, giving the engine an ELO RANGE.
>
>30.01.2005
>2937569 games
>
>Engine Popularity
>
>#	Engine	        N Games	Elo Avg.
>1.	shredder 8	1527113	2608	±21
>2.	fritz 8	        1061589	2543	±28
>3.	deep fritz 8	1032565	2612	±38
>4.	deep fritz 7	439209	2633	±52
>5.	hiarcs 9	317815	2549	±30
>6.	shredder 7.04	258551	2551	±29
>7.	fritz 7	        228719	2578	±37
>8.	junior 8	103815	2508	±22
>9.	x3d fritz	76805	2560	±28
>10.	deep junior 9	56381	2596	±26
>11.	deep junior 8	51025	2540	±25
>12.	junior 9	45999	2553	±26
>13.	chess tiger 15	45253	2514	±25
>14.	fritzinbahrain	37793	2501	±16
>15.	deep juniorem	28771	2642	±31
>16.	deep junior8.zx	22453	2535	±24
>17.	gambit tiger2.0	21613	2503	±23
>18.	ruffian 2.1.0	19755	2510	±8
>19.	the king 3.33	18969	2528	±15
>20.	shredder 7	18733	2510	±34
>21.	pro deo 1.0	17649	2468	±11
>22.	3d schach 4.0	16811	2519	±9
>23.	fritz 5.32	14259	2400	±7
>24.	fruit 2.0	13425	2537	±21
>25.	aristarch 4.50	12305	2472	±7
>26.	gandalf 6.0	11787	2508	±16
>27.	shredder 7.se	11099	2510	±18
>28.	junior 7	11037	2474	±13
>29.	ruffian 1.0.5	10861	2485	±21
>30.	chess tiger 14	10281	2514	±18
>31.	hiarcs8 bareev	9267	2483	±20
>32.	schachgenie 1.0	8763	2548	±9
>33.	list 512	8693	2448	±4
>34.	the king 3.23	8179	2469	±9
>35.	crafty 19.01	6803	2356	±6
>36.	fritz for fun 3	6751	2470	±5
>37.	deep sjeng 1.6	6265	2449	±2
>38.	the king 3.23r1	6047	2547	±3
>39.	hiarcs 8	5739	2460	±3
>
>Engine ELO Range
>
>Shredder 8     ELO 2587-2629
>Fritz 8        ELO 2515-2571
>Deep Fritz 8   ELO 2574-2650
>Deep Fritz 7   ELO 2581-2685
>Hiarcs 9       ELO 2519-2579
>Shredder 7.04  ELO 2522-2580
>Fritz 7        ELO 2541-2615
>Junior 8       ELO 2482-2530
>X3d Fritz      ELO 2532-2588
>Deep Junior 9  ELO 2573-2624
>Deep Junior 8  ELO 2515-2565
>Junior 9       ELO 2527-2579
>Chess Tiger 15 ELO 2489-2539
>FritzInBahrain ELO 2485-2517
>Deep Junior8EM ELO 2611-2673
>Deep Junior8ZX ELO 2514-2559
>Gambit Tiger 2 ELO 2480-2526
>Ruffian 2.1.0  ELO 2502-2518
>The King 3.33  ELO 2513-2543
>Shredder 7     ELO 2476-2544
>Pro Deo 1.0    ELO 2457-2479
>3d Schach 4.0  ELO 2510-2528
>Fritz 5.32     ELO 2393-2407
>Fruit 2.0      ELO 2515-2558
>Aristarch 4.5  ELO 2465-2479
>Gandolf 6.0    ELO 2492-2524
>Shredder 7SE   ELO 2492-2528
>Junior 7       ELO 2461-2487
>Ruffian 1.0.5  ELO 2464-2506
>Chess Tiger 14 ELO 2496-2532
>Hiarcs 8Bareev ELO 2463-2503
>Schachgenie1.0 ELO 2539-2557
>List 5.12      ELO 2444-2452
>The King 3.23  ELO 2460-2478
>Crafty 19.01   ELO 2350-2362
>Fritz for Fun3 ELO 2465-2475
>Deep Sjeng 1.6 ELO 2447-2451
>The King3.23r1 ELO 2544-2550
>Hiarcs 8       ELO 2457-2463
>
>Engine Rankings
>#	Engine	    Elo Range Avg.
>
>1.	deep juniorem	2642
>2.	deep fritz 7	2633
>3.	deep fritz 8	2612
>4.	shredder 8	2608
>5.	deep junior 9	2596
>6.	fritz 7	        2578
>7.	x3d fritz	2560
>8.	junior 9	2553
>9.	hiarcs 9	2549
>10.	schachgenie 1.0	2548
>11.	the king 3.23r1	2547
>12.	fritz 8	       	2543
>13.	shredder 7.04	2551
>14.	deep junior 8	2540
>15.	fruit 2.0	2537
>16.	deep junior8.zx	2535
>17.	the king 3.33	2528
>18.	3d schach 4.0	2519
>19.	chess tiger 15	2514
>20.	chess tiger 14	2514
>21.	shredder 7.se   2510
>22.	shredder 7	2510
>23.	ruffian 2.1.0	2510
>24.	gandalf 6.0	2508
>25.	junior 8	2508
>26.	gambit tiger2.0	2503
>27.	fritzinbahrain	2501
>28.	ruffian 1.0.5	2485
>29.	hiarcs8 bareev	2483
>30.	junior 7	2474
>31.	aristarch 4.50	2472
>32.	fritz for fun 3	2470
>33.	the king 3.23	2469
>34.	pro deo 1.0	2468
>35.	hiarcs 8	2460
>36.	deep sjeng 1.6	2449
>37.	list 512	2448
>38.	fritz 5.32	2400
>39.	crafty 19.01	2356
>
>For the list above, you can see the top 5 look out of order. That is not the
>case. The average of the program's ELO RANGE shows it potential on strength and
>consistency.
>
>Top 5
>#	Engine	   ELO RANGE  ELO RANGE Avg.
>1. Deep Junior8EM  2611-2673     2642
>2. Deep Fritz 7    2581-2685     2633
>3. Deep Fritz 8    2574-2650     2612
>4. Shredder 8      2587-2629     2608
>5. Deep Junior 9   2573-2624     2596
>
>You might ask why is Deep Junior 8EM so high on the list. I think a lot of it
>had to do with the hardware and books used when it played it's 28,000 + games.
>
>You might ask why is Fritz 7 ranked higher than Fritz 8? That is because at
>Fritz 7's ELO RANGE is a higher and the ELO RANGE average makes it stronger.
>It's just up to you to provide the right book, hardware, settings, etc. Then you
>might be at the higher end of the ELO RANGE.
>
>You also might ask, why is Shredder 8 in 4th? Even with 450,000 more games than
>any other engine it's potential never became as high of the others. With the
>right book, hardware, settings, etc., it could be stronger then the others most
>of the time. it's ELO RANGE average is still lower then the rest, as of now :)
>
>Finally, you might ask, what if all the programs played at it's highest value in
>the ELO RANGE? Then hypothetically, Deep Fritz 7 would win playing at 2685.
>
>If everything was ran on a uniform system, Same hardware, book, settings, then
>we could give it an approximate rating. Since we all know it's not, an ELO RANGE
>should be the solution.
>
>I hope to see this used more often.
>
>Joshua Haglund
>toneewa@yahoo.com

good morning joshua its hard enough with the present testing tell how strong
engine is. the testers now are doing a good job of tell about how strong an
engine is.i prefer to keep it simple as possible.i have a fast computer and a
slow computer and get about the same results with both. i get diff.results with
diff.books.i get diff.results with times controls. with 100 games tested on same
computer the two engines i tested get the same results as most of the other
tests posted here.

gerold.



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