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Subject: Re: How long to see black is winning + crafty bench

Author: Vincent Lejeune

Date: 08:40:03 03/27/05

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On March 27, 2005 at 11:36:34, Mike Byrne wrote:

>On March 27, 2005 at 11:18:35, Vincent Lejeune wrote:
>
>>On March 27, 2005 at 10:24:52, Mike Byrne wrote:
>>
>>>On March 27, 2005 at 06:56:35, Vincent Lejeune wrote:
>>>
>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 21:30:04, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 19:46:58, Vincent Lejeune wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 15:34:45, Dieter Buerssner wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 15:29:42, Dieter Buerssner wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On March 26, 2005 at 15:20:17, Mike Byrne wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>after the main line :  Kf2 f5 h3 Kc7 g3 hxg3 is winning no?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Black(2): his
>>>>>>>>>    white       black
>>>>>>>>>  1  Kf2         f5
>>>>>>>>>  2  h3          Kc7
>>>>>>>>>  3  g3          ...
>>>>>>>>>               17    25.52  -7.17   3. ... hxg3+ 4. Kxg3 f4+ 5. Kg4 b6
>>>>>>>>>                                    6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3 gxh4 8. c6 Kxc6 9.
>>>>>>>>>                                    Kg4 b5 10. a5 b4 11. Kxh4 Kb5 12. Kg4
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>In this line, Yace says 8. c6? is losing, while 8.cxb6 is draw.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>It is such an obvious blunder, that it looks like a bug in Crafty.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Regards,
>>>>>>>Dieter
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Probably a bug in the static eval of the pawn endgame. after 3 min@3 Ghz :
>>>>>
>>>>>I can't reproduce Mikes PV with this "c6 bug"...  I don't get c6 at any point
>>>>>that I can see, it always takes...
>>>>>
>>>>>Any ideas?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>I succeded to replicate c6 as best move :
>>>>1) without any EGTB
>>>>2) starting with this position 8/1p1k4/5p2/2Pp2p1/P2P3p/8/6PP/6K1 w - - 0 1
>>>>3) under chessbase interface
>>>>4) played 1. Kf2 f5 2. h3 Kc7 3. g3 hxg3+ 4. Kxg3 with 5 between each move
>>>>5) the score is rising for white but it so long I stopped
>>>>Is it a problem related to only pawns endgame eval or linked to hashtables too ?
>>>>
>>>
>>>I suggest not to test under Chessbase GUI unless you are using the native
>>>chessbase crafty engine.
>>
>>I use the native chessbase crafty engine.
>
>after Kxg3 above, you should see a draw score -- Crafty output from a console
>window is below  - anything else and something is broken -- in my case it was
>bad kppkp egtb.  I would contact Chessbase since they compiled thenative
>chessbase Crafty.
>
>White(4): Kxg3
>analyze.White(4): White(4): Kxg3
>              clearing hash tables
>              time surplus   0.00  time limit 10:00 (10:00)
>              depth   time  score   variation (1)
>                9     0.05  -0.50   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 b6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. cxb6+ Kxb6 9. Kg4 Ka5 10. Kxh4
>                                    Kxa4 (s=3)
>                9->   0.08  -0.50   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 b6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. cxb6+ Kxb6 9. Kg4 Ka5 10. Kxh4
>                                    Kxa4
>               10     0.10  -0.82   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 Ke7 9. a5 Ke6 10. Kxh4
>               10->   0.11  -0.82   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 Ke7 9. a5 Ke6 10. Kxh4
>               11     0.14  -0.72   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>                                    h4 f3 8. Kxf3 gxh4 9. Kg4 Ke7 10. Kxh4
>               11->   0.16  -0.72   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>                                    h4 f3 8. Kxf3 gxh4 9. Kg4 Ke7 10. Kxh4
>               12     0.22  -0.50   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>                                    c6 Kc7 8. cxb7 Kxb7 9. h4 f3 10. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 11. Kg4 Ka6 12. Kxh4 Kxa5
>               12->   0.25  -0.50   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>                                    c6 Kc7 8. cxb7 Kxb7 9. h4 f3 10. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 11. Kg4 Ka6 12. Kxh4 Kxa5
>               13     0.33  -0.60   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>                                    Kf3 Kc7 8. Kg2 Kb8 9. Kf2 Ka7 10. c6
>                                    bxc6 11. Kf3
>               13->   0.43  -0.60   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kd7 6. a5 Kd8 7.
>                                    Kf3 Kc7 8. Kg2 Kb8 9. Kf2 Ka7 10. c6
>                                    bxc6 11. Kf3
>               14     0.58     +1   4. ... f4+
>               14     0.78  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB>
>               14->   0.89  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB>
>               15     1.05  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB>
>               15->   1.18  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>               16     1.49  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB>
>               16->   1.80  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>               17     2.60  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB>
>               17->   3.11  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>               18     4.30  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB>
>               18->   5.47  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>               19     8.07  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB>
>               19->  11.30  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB> (s=2)
>               20    18.07  -0.01   4. ... f4+ 5. Kg4 Kc6 6. h4 f3 7. Kxf3
>                                    gxh4 8. Kg4 b6 9. cxb6 Kxb6 10. Kxh4
>                                    <EGTB>
>               20    24.85    8/9?  4. ... g4

I succeded to replicate c6 as best move :
1) without any EGTB
2) starting with this position 8/1p1k4/5p2/2Pp2p1/P2P3p/8/6PP/6K1 w - - 0 1
3) under chessbase interface
4) played 1. Kf2 f5 2. h3 Kc7 3. g3 hxg3+ 4. Kxg3 with 5 seconds between each
move (?)



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