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Subject: Re: Settings Pro Deo 1.1 Betazoid T90

Author: Eelco de Groot

Date: 09:16:58 05/06/05

Go up one level in this thread


On May 05, 2005 at 23:41:09, Eelco de Groot wrote:

>On May 05, 2005 at 21:04:42, Eelco de Groot wrote:
>
>
>>
>>I was not entirely happy with what Betazoid T90 plays here in the testposition
>>from the Ed schroder-Rebel 12 game:
>>
>>[D]rnbq1rk1/pp1n1p1p/4p1p1/3pP1NP/1b3P2/1PpB4/P1P3P1/R1BQK2R b KQ - 0 1
>>
>>Best choices moves are I think Nc6, or Nxe5 which leads to 0.00 score.
>>
>>T90 over Ed-Rebel 12, met 40 Mb transposition tables
>>
>>00:00:01.5	3,14	4	7232	h6 Nxf7 Kxf7 Qg4 g5 fxg5
>>00:00:01.6	0,94	5	23971	h6 hxg6 Nxe5 fxe5 hxg5 g7 Kxg7
>>00:00:01.7	1,86	5	37584	Bc5 Nxh7 Nxe5 Nxf8 Nxd3+ Qxd3
>>00:00:01.8	2,30	5	45422	Qb6 hxg6 hxg6 Qe2 Nc6 Be3
>>00:00:01.9	2,34	5	52523	Nc5 hxg6 hxg6 Rh7 Nxd3+ Qxd3 Qxg5 Rg7+
>>00:00:01.9	2,98	5	60858	Be7 hxg6 hxg6 Nf3 Qb6 a4
>>00:00:02.4	3,25	6	103759	Be7 hxg6 hxg6 Nf3 Qb6 a3 Nc6
>>00:00:03.6	2,48	7	215877	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Kxh7 hxg6+ Kg7 gxf7 Nxe5 Qh5 Nxd3
>>Rxh4 Nxc1
>>00:00:07.7	2,48	8	694891	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Kxh7 hxg6+ Kg7 gxf7 Nxe5 Qh5 Nxd3
>>Rxh4 Nxc1
>>00:00:42.5	0,65	9	5143236	Be7 Nxh7 Na6 hxg6 Bh4+ Kf1 fxg6 Nxf8
>>00:00:50.5	0,86	9	6144608	Bc5 Nxh7 Re8 hxg6 f6 Qh5
>>00:02:09.7	1,03	9	16190937	Qc7 hxg6 fxg6 Nxe6
>>00:05:20.0	0,20	10	42047386	Qc7 Nxh7 Nxe5
>>00:05:42.6	0,27	10	44901986	Bc5 Nxh7 Qe8 Nxf8 Nxf8 hxg6
>>00:06:13.4	0,64	10	49010035	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Kxh7 Qg4 Kg7 Rxh4 Rh8
>>00:08:41.7	0,69	10	67141584	Nf6 exf6 Qxf6 hxg6 hxg6 Be3
>>00:09:57.5	-1,12	11	77186856	Nf6 exf6 Qxf6 Nxh7 Qh8 hxg6 e5 gxf7+ Rxf7 Bg6 Rd7
>>00:12:49.6	-0,49	11	100198126	Be7 hxg6 fxg6 Bxg6
>>00:19:37.0	0,00	11	157734728	Qc7 hxg6 fxg6 Rxh7 Qc5
>>00:20:19.3	0,30	11	163233980	Bc5 Nxh7 Na6 hxg6 fxg6 Bxg6
>>00:32:37.4	0,28	12	261283350	Bc5 Nxh7 Nc6 hxg6 fxg6 Bxg6
>
>I thought that Betazoid T8 would do better in this particular position, but I
>cannot reproduce the earlier results! Nc6 is chosen, but only after 34 minutes,
>later Nxe5 comes back. In an earlier result, Nc6 was chosen much sooner. Why
>this could have happened, only thing I can think of is maybe not all hashtable
>results were gone. I have no learning switches so there should be no position
>learning at all. There is no Clear hashtables Always switch in Betazoid, so that
>could be a partial cause. Maybe I forgot to set 'Clear hash' under Advanced
>properties that time, when loading a new personality.
>
>What I said then in my post before above about the effect of different hashtable
>size also does not hold, as that referred to testing this position with 40 Mb
>HT. But the 28 MB results are not reproducible.
>
>Conclusion then that maybe Betazoid T90 will not differ much from Betazoid T8
>and could be worth further testing. I would rather have some version that does
>not play Bc5, but that may not be so easy..
>
>Betazoid T8 with 28 Mb HT not like first results
>
>00:00:01.6	0,94	5	24372	h6 hxg6 Nxe5 fxe5 hxg5 g7 Kxg7
>00:00:01.8	1,86	5	40105	Bc5 Nxh7 Nxe5 Nxf8 Nxd3+ Qxd3
>00:00:01.8	2,30	5	47966	Qb6 hxg6 hxg6 Qe2 Nc6 Be3
>00:00:01.9	2,34	5	55120	Nc5 hxg6 hxg6 Rh7 Nxd3+ Qxd3 Qxg5 Rg7+
>00:00:02.0	2,44	5	63221	Nc6 Nxh7 Ncxe5 Nxf8 Nxd3+ Qxd3
>00:00:02.2	2,98	5	70733	Be7 hxg6 hxg6 Nf3 Qb6 a4
>00:00:02.6	3,25	6	93710	Be7 hxg6 hxg6 Nf3 Qb6 a3 Nc6
>00:00:03.7	2,48	7	201797	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Kxh7 hxg6+ Kg7 gxf7 Nxe5 Qh5 Nxd3
>Rxh4 Nxc1
>00:00:08.9	2,07	8	828009	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Kxh7 hxg6+ Kg7 gxf7 Nxe5 Qh5 Nxd3
>Rxh4 Qxh4 Qxh4 Kxf7
>00:00:42.5	0,73	9	5074778	Be7 Nxh7 Nc6 Nxf8 Nxf8 g3 Nb4
>00:01:27.0	0,80	9	10818820	Qb6 Nxh7 Qd4 hxg6 fxg6 Nxf8 Bc5 Qf3
>00:01:46.5	1,03	9	13489670	Qc7 hxg6 fxg6 Nxe6
>00:06:03.5	0,23	10	48807141	Qc7 Nxh7 Nxe5 fxe5 Qxe5+ Kf1
>00:06:22.6	0,60	10	51342908	Qb6 Nxh7 Qd4 hxg6 fxg6 Nxf8 Bc5 Qf3 Nxf8 Qg3
>00:06:40.2	0,71	10	53604700	Be7 Nxh7 Nc6 Nxf8 Nxf8 g3 Nb4
>00:09:49.9	0,83	10	77978287	Nf6 exf6 Qxf6 hxg6 hxg6 Be3
>00:11:39.8	-1,12	11	93383561	Nf6 exf6 Qxf6 Nxh7 Qh8 hxg6 e5 Rf1
>00:20:04.4	-0,23	11	165036661	Be7 hxg6 fxg6 Bxg6
>00:25:50.5	0,00	11	212952428	Qc7 hxg6 fxg6 Rxh7 Qc5
>00:32:38.9	0,23	11	269069774	Nxe5 fxe5 Qc7 Nxh7 Qxe5+ Kf1
>00:34:56.7	0,30	11	288216946	Nc6 hxg6 fxg6 Nxh7 Qe7 Nxf8 Nxf8
>00:47:15.4	0,03	12	386966333	Nc6 hxg6 fxg6 Nxh7 Ne7
>00:51:26.5	0,23	12	424254610	Nxe5 fxe5 Qc7 Nxh7 Qxe5+ Kf1

Okay, it gets more complicated.

I ran this postion again but now with even less HT, 13 Mb. Now I get two a bit
optimistic scores for Nc6 and Nxe5 respectively, at ten ply. This somehow seems
to stabilize the search a bit, around the point where hashtables are full.
Eventually Nc6 or Nxe5 is chosen.

In a way this is a pity because in this particular position then with bigger
hashtables the results are just worse in finding Nc6 or Nxe5. And you would like
to use bigger hashtables if you can! In games between two programs sofar I
always used 13 Mb, otherwise the harddisk starts swapping. Even if this presumed
effect of hashtable size happens in very few positions, it can still cause very
different results. All this assuming I got the hashtables cleared this time, I
still cannot reproduce the earliest Betazoid T8 lines in this position
(certainly not with 28 Mb hashtables). They are not very different, but just a
little.

 Nogmaals deze stelling, Pro Deo 1.1 Betazoid T8 met 13 Mb HT

00:00:01.1	3,14	2	975	h6 a3
00:00:01.2	3,35	3	1839	h6 Nf3 gxh5 Rxh5
00:00:01.2	3,14	4	7232	h6 Nxf7 Kxf7 Qg4 g5 fxg5
00:00:01.3	0,94	5	24372	h6 hxg6 Nxe5 fxe5 hxg5 g7 Kxg7
00:00:01.5	1,86	5	40105	Bc5 Nxh7 Nxe5 Nxf8 Nxd3+ Qxd3
00:00:01.5	2,30	5	47966	Qb6 hxg6 hxg6 Qe2 Nc6 Be3
00:00:01.6	2,34	5	55120	Nc5 hxg6 hxg6 Rh7 Nxd3+ Qxd3 Qxg5 Rg7+
00:00:01.7	2,44	5	63221	Nc6 Nxh7 Ncxe5 Nxf8 Nxd3+ Qxd3
00:00:01.8	2,98	5	70733	Be7 hxg6 hxg6 Nf3 Qb6 a4
00:00:02.2	3,25	6	93710	Be7 hxg6 hxg6 Nf3 Qb6 a3 Nc6
00:00:03.3	2,48	7	201797	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Kxh7 hxg6+ Kg7 gxf7 Nxe5 Qh5 Nxd3
Rxh4 Nxc1
00:00:08.5	2,07	8	830948	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Kxh7 hxg6+ Kg7 gxf7 Nxe5 Qh5 Nxd3
Rxh4 Qxh4 Qxh4 Kxf7
00:00:41.4	0,73	9	5054804	Be7 Nxh7 Nc6 Nxf8 Nxf8 g3 Nb4
00:01:23.3	0,80	9	10547236	Qb6 Nxh7 Qd4 hxg6
00:01:42.6	1,03	9	13257609	Qc7 hxg6 fxg6 Nxe6 Qc6
00:05:39.2	0,33	10	46287951	Qc7 Nxh7 Nc6 Nxf8 Nxf8 Qg4
00:06:12.3	0,60	10	50747032	Qb6 hxg6 fxg6 Nxh7 Qd4 Nxf8 Bc5 Qf3 Nxf8 Qg3
00:06:44.4	0,65	10	55096524	Be7 Nxh7 Na6 Nxf8 Nxf8 hxg6 Bh4+
00:07:21.3	0,66	10	60158369	Nc6 Nxh7 Re8 hxg6 f6 Nxf6+ Nxf6 g7 Kf7 exf6
00:13:15.2	0,30	11	107677884	Nc6 hxg6 fxg6 Nxh7 Qe7
00:34:17.8	0,03	12	281794255	Nc6 hxg6 fxg6 Nxh7 Ne7 Qg4
00:51:28.4	0,23	12	428346574	Nxe5 fxe5 Qc7 Nxh7 Qxe5+ Kf1 Nd7 hxg6

Betazoid T90b with 13 Mb. Nxe5 fails low at 11 ply, and that takes some time.
Probably have to run this again to see if I can reproduce this. But glad that
Nc6 or Nxe5 are chosen (I'm assuming they are better than Nf6 or Be7).

00:00:01.0	1,83	1	26	gxh5 Bxh7+ Kh8 Qxh5
00:00:01.0	3,71	1	28	Nc6
00:00:01.0	3,78	1	48	Qb6
00:00:01.1	2,76	2	194	Qb6 hxg6 hxg6
00:00:01.1	2,86	2	302	Bc5 hxg6 hxg6
00:00:01.1	3,14	2	975	h6 a3
00:00:01.1	3,35	3	1855	h6 Nf3 gxh5 Rxh5
00:00:01.2	3,14	4	7298	h6 Nxf7 Kxf7 Qg4 g5 fxg5
00:00:01.3	0,94	5	24413	h6 hxg6 Nxe5 fxe5 hxg5 g7 Kxg7
00:00:01.4	1,86	5	38251	Bc5 Nxh7 Nxe5 Nxf8 Nxd3+ Qxd3
00:00:01.5	2,10	5	51761	Qb6 Nxh7 Kxh7 hxg6+ Kg8 g7 Rd8 Rh8+
00:00:01.6	2,34	5	58903	Nc5 hxg6 hxg6 Rh7 Nxd3+ Qxd3 Qxg5 Rg7+
00:00:01.7	2,98	5	67231	Be7 hxg6 hxg6 Nf3 Qb6 a4
00:00:02.2	3,25	6	106818	Be7 hxg6 hxg6 Nf3 Qb6 a3 Nc6
00:00:04.5	2,17	7	378767	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Kxh7 hxg6+ Kg7 Qh5
00:00:10.6	1,76	8	1069190	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Nxe5 Nxf8 Nxd3 Qxd3 Kxf8 Ba3+ Kg7
00:00:25.7	1,56	9	2902544	Be7 hxg6 hxg6 Bxg6 Bxg5 Qh5
00:01:22.2	0,89	10	10086240	Be7 Nxh7 Bh4+ Kf1 Kxh7 Qg4 Kg7 Rxh4
00:02:52.6	1,02	10	22500670	Nxe5 fxe5 Qc7 Qe2 f6 exf6 Rxf6 hxg6 Qg3+
00:11:47.2	0,14	11	100072939	Nxe5 fxe5 Qc7 Nxh7 Qxe5+ Kf1
00:19:59.2	0,30	11	167584346	Nc6 Nxh7 Bc5 Nxf8 Nxf8 hxg6 fxg6 Qg4

 Just trying to be complete regards,
 Eelco




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