Author: Uri Blass
Date: 01:21:31 09/04/05
Go up one level in this thread
On September 04, 2005 at 03:44:41, Kurt Utzinger wrote: >On September 04, 2005 at 02:54:38, Uri Blass wrote: > >>On September 04, 2005 at 01:46:56, Kurt Utzinger wrote: >> >>>[D]3k4/1r2p3/r2pPp2/b1pP1Pp1/1pP3Pp/pP5P/P2K4/8 b - - >>> >>>Start with this position. If an engine shows >>>a huge advantage for black, it will never solve >>>the problem. BTW: this position has nothing to do >>>with deep calculation, it's a matter of knowledge. >>>Kurt >> >>I dsagree. >> >>An engine can show a huge advantage and still solve the problem after enough >>time because of seeing bigger advantage for black for the alternatives. >> >>Uri > > Hi Uri > In this particular case I disagree. If you have a > look at the initial position where White still > has two bishops I can't imagine that an engine > will by deep calculation ever evaluate the above > position being better than the initial position. > Kurt > with leas Note that the original post talked about deep calculation and I think that it may be a question of time and engines may need some years of calculation to find it. I admit that no engine can find the right move without knowledge in a short time but if you give it some years then the result may be different. I am not going to test it but I tried to use Fruit for 80 minutes and my results are at the bottom of this post. Note that score of 13 pawns for black is needed to see that black is winning After 5 minutes the score is 6.93 pawns for black After 80 minutes score is 8.39 pawns for black.(1.46 pawns difference) If we assume same progress in score we are going to see after 80*16 minutes the score is 8.39+1.46=9.85 pawns for black(slightly less than 24 hours) after 80*16*16 minutes score is 9.85+1.46=11.31 pawns for black in less than 15 days. After 80*16*16*16 minutes score is near 13 pawns for black in less than a year. In a few years fruit2.1 may find it but it may be faster to wait one year for fabien to fix some search bugs that may make it few months or even few weeks. Here is analysis: New game, [D]3B4/1r2p3/r2p1p2/bkp1P1p1/1p1P1PPp/p1P4P/PP1K4/3B4 w - - 0 1 Analysis by Fruit 2.1: 1.Bxa5 Rxa5 -+ (-6.55) Depth: 1/16 00:00:00 1.Be2+ c4 -+ (-5.91) Depth: 1/20 00:00:00 1.Be2+ c4 2.Bxa5 Rxa5 -+ (-6.47) Depth: 2/20 00:00:00 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Be2+ Kxd4 3.Bxa6 axb2 -+ (-6.40) Depth: 2/20 00:00:00 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Be2+ Kxd4 3.Bxa6 axb2 -+ (-6.40) Depth: 3/20 00:00:00 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Be2+ Kxd4 3.Bxa6 axb2 4.Kc2 -+ (-5.82) Depth: 4/20 00:00:00 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.Be2+ Kxd4 3.Bxa6 axb2 4.Kc2 Ra7 -+ (-5.83) Depth: 5/21 00:00:00 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 Rb8 4.Bxa5 Rxa5 5.fxg5 -+ (-6.03) Depth: 6/22 00:00:00 162kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 e5 4.Be2 Raa7 5.Bxa5 Rxa5 6.fxg5 -+ (-5.91) Depth: 7/23 00:00:00 330kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 exf6 4.Bxf6+ Ke4 5.Be2 Ra8 6.fxg5 -+ (-5.78) Depth: 8/25 00:00:00 584kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 exf6 4.Bxf6+ Ke4 5.Bxg5 d5 6.Bc2+ Kf3 7.f5 -+ (-5.60) Depth: 9/26 00:00:01 1038kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 exf6 4.Bxf6+ Ke4 5.Bxg5 d5 6.Bc2+ Kf3 7.f5 Rh7 -+ (-5.59) Depth: 10/32 00:00:07 7027kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 e5 4.Be7 Ra8 5.fxg5 Rxe7 6.fxe7 Re8 7.Bf3 Rxe7 -+ (-5.88) Depth: 11/32 00:00:09 8551kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 Ra8 4.Bxe7 gxf4 5.Bxd6 Rd7 6.Be7 Re8 7.g5 Rexe7 8.fxe7 Rxe7 -+ (-5.82) Depth: 12/33 00:00:12 12129kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 Ra8 4.Bxe7 gxf4 5.Bxd6 Rd7 6.Bf3 Rxd6 7.Bxa8 Ke5+ 8.Ke2 Kxf6 -+ (-5.97) Depth: 13/36 00:00:30 28646kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 Ra8 4.Bxe7 Rxe7 5.fxe7 gxf4 6.Bf3 Re8 7.g5 Rxe7 8.g6 d5 9.Be2 -+ (-6.80) Depth: 14/46 00:01:11 66922kN 1.exf6 axb2 2.Kc2 e6 3.c4+ Kc6 4.d5+ exd5 5.cxd5+ Kd7 6.Bxa5 Rxa5 7.Kxb2 gxf4 8.g5 c4 9.Bf3 Rba7 10.Bg4+ Kd8 -+ (-6.66) Depth: 14/48 00:02:46 157421kN 1.exf6 axb2 2.Kc2 e6 3.c4+ Kc6 4.d5+ exd5 5.cxd5+ Kd7 6.Bxa5 Rxa5 7.Kxb2 gxf4 8.g5 c4 9.g6 Rba7 10.Bg4+ Kd8 11.a4 Rxa4 -+ (-6.93) Depth: 15/58 00:04:34 259191kN 1.exf6 axb2 2.Kc2 Bxd8 3.c4+ Ka5 4.f7 b3+ 5.Kxb2 bxa2+ 6.Ka1 Rb1+ 7.Kxa2 Rb8 8.Ka3 Bc7 9.fxg5 Kb6+ 10.Kb2 cxd4 11.Bb3 Kc5 12.g6 d3 -+ (-8.44) Depth: 16/64 00:12:42 710200kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 Ra8 4.Bxe7 Rxe7 5.fxe7 gxf4 6.Be2 Re8 7.g5 Rxe7 8.g6 d5 9.Bf3 c4 10.Kc2 -+ (-7.18) Depth: 16/64 00:12:59 727833kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 Ra8 4.Bxe7 Rxe7 5.fxe7 gxf4 6.g5 Re8 7.Ke2 Rxe7+ 8.Kf3 Rg7 9.Kxf4 Bd8 10.g6 Rxg6 11.Bf3 Bg5+ 12.Kf5 -+ (-7.18) Depth: 17/64 00:15:17 867420kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 Ra8 4.Bxe7 Rxe7 5.fxe7 gxf4 6.g5 Re8 7.Be2 Rxe7 8.g6 d5 9.Bg4 c4 10.Kc2 c3 11.Bf3 -+ (-7.40) Depth: 18/64 00:19:11 1100282kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 Ra8 4.Bxe7 Rxe7 5.fxe7 gxf4 6.g5 Re8 7.Ke2 Rxe7+ 8.Kf3 Re1 9.Bc2 Rf1+ 10.Kg4 Ra1 11.Kxf4 Rxa2 12.Be4 Rf2+ 13.Bf3 -+ (-7.77) Depth: 19/64 00:31:56 1846165kN 1.c4+ Kxc4 2.b3+ Kxd4 3.exf6 Ra8 4.Bxe7 Rxe7 5.fxe7 gxf4 6.g5 Re8 7.Ke2 Rxe7+ 8.Kf3 Re1 9.Bc2 Rf1+ 10.Ke2 Rc1 11.Bf5 Ra1 12.g6 Rxa2+ 13.Kf3 Rb2 -+ (-8.39) Depth: 20/66 01:11:34 4130546kN (, 04.09.2005) Uri
This page took 0 seconds to execute
Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700
Current Computer Chess Club Forums at Talkchess. This site by Sean Mintz.