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Subject: Re: Fruit 2.2's strength

Author: Uri Blass

Date: 21:08:23 10/25/05

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On October 25, 2005 at 23:31:08, Dann Corbit wrote:

>On October 25, 2005 at 21:39:26, Will Singleton wrote:
>
>>On October 25, 2005 at 19:44:58, Dann Corbit wrote:
>>
>>>On October 25, 2005 at 14:56:43, Will Singleton wrote:
>>>
>>>>On October 25, 2005 at 12:56:43, Dann Corbit wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On October 25, 2005 at 12:28:07, Lar Mader wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>I realize that this is a difficult question...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I'm curious about what makes Fruit 2.2 so strong.  Also, it is impressive how
>>>>>>quickly Fabien achieved this strength.  Fritz 9 and Shredder 9 seem to be close
>>>>>>to Fruit 2.2 in strength, and yet they have been in development for a much
>>>>>>longer time with a lot more resources.  Has anyone spent any time examining the
>>>>>>2.1 source code, or have any other insights into what this program does that
>>>>>>makes it so effective?
>>>>>
>>>>>Fabien does everything well.  He is a magnificent and careful programmer.  He
>>>>>obviously puts a lot of effort into making things correct.  He has a lot of
>>>>>insight to pick out what is important and concentrate on that.
>>>>>
>>>>>His search is excellent and innovative.  He does some things that nobody else
>>>>>does.  I'm not really sure how he is able to not hash the PV and still have a
>>>>>stupendously fast search, but that is pretty amazing.
>>>>>
>>>><snip>
>>>>
>>>>I haven't looked at Fruit's code, but I'm interested in your pv comment.  What
>>>>is the difference between storing the pv to hash, and simply playing the pv out
>>>>of an array?
>>>
>>>What is more important in move ordering than being a pv node?
>>
>>Perhaps I wasn't clear.  afaik, the purpose of storing the pv to hash is to
>>enable the pv moves to be played first.  Whether you store them to hash or to a
>>special pv array shouldn't matter, if you recognize a node as a pv node and play
>>the pv move.
>>
>>If we are in agreement on that (and perhaps I'm missing something), then are you
>>saying that Fruit doesn't make use of its pv for move-ordering at all?  I would
>>find that unusual.
>
>http://chessprogramming.org/cccsearch/ccc.php?art_id=354644

I only see
No PV cut-off's in Fruit

I do not see that he claims that he is not using the pv for move ordering.

Uri



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