Author: odell hall
Date: 06:21:29 03/26/99
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On March 26, 1999 at 07:50:11, Micheal Cummings wrote: >Hi there Sarah > >First off the game that Odell posted gives a more than likely view that the >person playing the game used the Fritz chess engine. But that is not what I and >some others are worried about. > So, Let me make sure I understand you correctly, You are saying that You know that guy used a computer but I don't have a right to call him a cheater even though he cheated me!! Your nuts >What we are making such a big noise over is the fact that Odell wants to gives >names or handles and to judge this person before any chess server has the chance Here you go again , saying things you have no idea what your talking about. I never came to this forum asking anyone to judge this person. I simply ask for opinions as to if this person used a computer. You need to look up the word judge. I am not an admininstrator I have no power to judge this indivisual, nor does anyone in this forum, this is not ICC. Naming someone's handle is not judging. It is providing information. I do have the right to call someone a cheat if they cheat me. I have no doubt that ICC would not even say the nonsense that you are saying. ICC is not ALL-Powerful, as if to control people's free expression. And again Naming someone's handle is not slandeur libel, or anything else. Remember intent is important word here. >to boot him off, it is their server this person might be cheating on, and their >right to call him a cheater. > >If Odell came on here and said that this person had been booted by ICC and that >here was the game and said that it looks like he cheated Odell's for a win, then This statement does not make any sense, if the server had judged the man a cheater and kicked him off, I would not need to come here for confirmation. >I would not have a problem. Because the right people would have judged him a >cheat and thus Odell could then name this person, cause the server would have >made that decision, which is their right too. So Michael if someone came up to you and mugged you on the street, your telling me that you can not call him a mugger, because he has not yet went to court and been convicted of mugging?? Well this is exactly what you are saying in the above, that unless Icc officially say's that I have been cheated I have no right to claim it here. Absurd! I don't believe you believe your own words. >But I think Odell or no one for that matter has no right to name this person in >public, before the relevant people have time to deal with him (namely the chess >server admins). > >He can post all the games he wants about peope he played against that he >suspects cheat on him. Just as long as he does not name who they are. Unless >these people have been proved cheats by the relevant people. (not Odell, unless >Odell played this person one on one in person, or on his own chess server, then >he would be the one to make that decision and thus any repercusions that might >follow for getting it wrong) And I will continue to post all the games I want, as long as no one who matters has any objections, meaning moderators, which you are not. You have absolutely no authority, neither legally or morally to tell me, I cannot name someone who has wronged me. And let me remind you that naming is not the same as judging, for the latter requires authority to take action. Certainly you are not referring to judgement on a subjective level, that you can not control. things > >How do we know that ICC forgot to add the (c) to his handle. > >I mean just say he named a GM handle, even though it is a handle most people >would know who it is. I know people from CCC's handle on ICC. Does that mean a >handle makes it safe for him to name names, when for at least some, we know who >he is talking about. > >This forum should not be a place for speculation and innuendo or rumours. Even >with proof I would not name someone as a cheat. I would take it to the relevant >authorities and let them deal with it. It is just a shame that Odell and some >others on here feel as though they can be the Judge, Jury and executioner. > Show me any statements I made that was speculation, and innuendo, if you call a 100% match with fritz 5 speculation, you have a serious problem with reality. Nearly everyone here agreed that the games were played by a computer, including the resident computer experts. Where are you getting this ennuendo stuff? >We have System in place on chess servers to deal with these situations as we do >in life with courts. We should leave it up to the right people and when the >judgement has been made then we can comment. but Odell wants to give his >judgement, no matter how strong or weak it is, and to condem this person befre >he has a chance to reply. Reply to what? He was caught redhanded! His fingerprints all over the crime scence. And there you go with the words judge, and condemn inspite of my insistence to the contrary. Let me ask you something, when did I ever condemn or ask that this forum take action against this indivisual. Although if I had, I don't see why you would view that as wrong. > >I would like to say that when someone in life commits an obvious crime, they are >still put on trial and given a chance to defend themselves. Odell does not want >to follow this system. He wants to give his proof to the public, and let them >decide for themselves who is right or wrong. without having all the facts. > >At least the server admins would at least ask this person why this situation >seems to show that a chess program was used, and at least give the person the >chance to explain. I just think what Odell did was wrong, and he talks about >people having a narrow mind, from what I can see, all he is seeing is black and >white. Michael, I am beginning to understand you more, and more. Since you have no real case against me, and have yet to produce one shred of evidence that I even breeched CCC rules, You have to invent whatever you can, even if it makes no sense even to yourself. I don't need ICC permision to call a spade a spade, and if you don't like it. Too Bad!! I do not come to CCC to please you. I have been posting on CCC , of and on for nearly a year, I have never attacked anyone here or started any type of controversy. If I am guilty in this matter, it is because I have kept responding unneccesarily to people who really deserve no response at all. For some strange unknown reason you want to make something huge out of nothing.
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