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Subject: Re: How To Beat These Pesky Computers: Increase The Size Of Chess

Author: Walter Faxon

Date: 01:29:15 02/28/06

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On February 25, 2006 at 06:15:01, Graham Laight wrote:

>Instead of playing on an 8x8 board, play on an 80x80 board, with each side
>having 80 pawns, 20 rooks, 20 knights, 20 bishops, 10 queens and 10 kings - each
>of which must be taken to win the game (I'll call this "super chess").
>
>For illustration, late me make some sweeping assumptions about chess: suppose
>that each position has an average of 37 moves, and that a chess computer looks
>at 2 billion (2*10^9) positions per move. In super chess, there would be an
>average of well over 10*37 = 370 moves per position, because rooks, bishops and
>queens would have more moves, and knights and other pieces would also have more
>moves available on average, so lets say that the average number of moves would
>be 1000 per position.
>
>In chess, the number of ply the computer can search comprehensively is:
>
>37^n = 2*10^9
>log(37)*n = log(2*10^9)
>n = log(2*10^9)/log(37)
>n = 5.93
>
>We all know, of course, that extensions can reach a much deeper level than this.
>
>In super chess, the depth of the comprehensive search is:
>
>log(2*10^9)/log(1000) = 3.1 - which is not nearly enough to play well. The
>extensions will be even more seriously impacted.
>
>So - each time the programmers get a bit uppity, all we have to do is challenge
>them to a game of super chess!
>
>-g


Martin Gardner (of Scientific American "Mathematical Games" fame) wrote in his
"Fads and Fallacies in the Name of Science" about collector-of-strange-facts
Charles Fort's invention of "super checkers" (as in English Draughts), played on
a large chequered tablecloth spread over the floor, with a hundred or more
pieces a side.  One key point:  Like real armies, more than one move could be
made at a time (though still alternately).  Checkers is also a
better/more-understandable model for battle simulation because most moves are
short-range.  No worries about that bishop 50 squares away.

But we really don't need to develop either "super chess" or "super checkers".
There is already a thriving market in strategic games, often modeled on real
campaigns in the history of warfare.  They're played on large boards, but unlike
chess and checkers the boards are mostly hexagonal.

-W



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