Author: pete
Date: 09:47:45 07/04/99
Go up one level in this thread
On July 04, 1999 at 10:43:57, Pete Galati wrote:
>On July 04, 1999 at 10:03:19, Pete Galati wrote:
>
>>On July 04, 1999 at 01:47:51, Gerrit Reubold wrote:
>>
>>>On July 03, 1999 at 19:48:49, Pete Galati wrote:
>>>
>>>>On July 03, 1999 at 19:16:59, Gerrit Reubold wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Hi all,
>>>>>
>>>>>please test your programs with the following position
>>>>>
>>>>>5rk1/1r3pp1/pp2pq2/3p4/3Q4/1PR5/P4PPP/4R1K1 w - -
>>>>>
>>>>>it is from a game which my program (Bringer) lost with white against The Crazy
>>>>>Bishop. The draw is very easy to see (for humans): Qxf6 gxf6, and then rook
>>>>>checks at h3, g3, f3... How long does your program take to find Qxf6 *with a
>>>>>draw score*. How many plies / seconds? Question to the programmers: What do you
>>>>>do to solve such positions fast? Extending on checks is not enough, my program
>>>>>needs a 12 ply search (8 minutes on a PII-300) to find the draw (Qxf6 is found
>>>>>earlier).
>>>>>
>>>>>Greetings,
>>>>>Gerrit Reubold
>>>>
>>>>Every program that I ran that posistion through, Crafty, Comet, Phalanx and your
>>>>Bringer all responded with QxQ. What did Bringer play in that game? I like
>>>>Bringer allot, it works well with Winboard and it also has a very good interface
>>>>of it's own.
>>>>
>>>>Pete
>>>
>>>Bringer likes Qd3 for some minutes, because I have a rule not to trade pieces
>>>when behind in material, especially not when the opponent king is (a bit) less
>>>safe. The Question was: how long do the other programs need to find the draw,
>>>not only the key move. I tested Fritz5.16, the draw was seen instantly,
>>>impressive. Hiarcs 6 does like QxQ instantly, but needs some minutes to see the
>>>draw.
>>>BTW: isn't QxQ a blunder as long as you don't see the draw, trading to an
>>>endgame a pawn down?
>>>
>>>Greetings
>>>Gerrit
>>
>>Judging it as a human player, and to be honest I didn't observe how long it took
>>any of those programs to find a draw (I just had them play the next move), I
>>think that QxQ is the correct move because then PxQ so R-kt3ch and the King has
>>to move to the Rook file. But now because of the blacks pawn placement, I see no
>> easy way to a checkmate, maybe a stronger player would, but I don't see it.
>>
>>I'm thinkink that the black King has to be sweating right now :-) I don't see it
>>as a draw game, I see white winning this one, King safety is gone for the black
>>side.
>>
>>Pete
>
>Gerrit,
>
>This has to show you what a lousy Chess player I am, but I ran that position
>past a couple of Crafty programs, and although the first move was QxQ, the rest
>was quite different than what I was expecting, I let it play for 20 moves, it
>looked like white had lost the game (?) see below.
>
>Pete
>
>
>[Event "Computer chess game"]
>[Site "DEFAULT"]
>[Date "1999.07.04"]
>[Round "-"]
>[White "wCrafty-16_11"]
>[Black "wCrafty-16_6"]
>[Result "*"]
>[TimeControl "60/900"]
>[FEN "5rk1/1r3pp1/pp2pq2/3p4/3Q4/1PR5/P4PPP/4R1K1 w - - 0 1"]
>[SetUp "1"]
>
>{--------------
>. . . . . r k .
>. r . . . p p .
>p p . . p q . .
>. . . p . . . .
>. . . Q . . . .
>. P R . . . . .
>P . . . . P P P
>. . . . R . K .
>white to play
>--------------}
>1. Qxf6 gxf6 2. Kf1 Rd8 3. Ke2 Kf8 4. Rec1 Ke7 5. g3 f5 6. h4 f4 7. Rc7+
>Rd7 8. Rxd7+ Rxd7 9. g4 Kd6 10. h5 f6 11. f3 Rh7 12. Rc8 f5 13. Rb8 Kc5 14.
>Rc8+ Kd4 15. Rc6 fxg4 16. fxg4 e5 17. Rxb6 e4 18. Rxa6 Rg7 19. Rg6 f3+ 20.
>Kf2 Rf7 21. Re6
>*
Yes ; this strange Kf1, Ke2 is the only thing crafty 16.11 can fínd in about 5
minutes on a PII 300 ( was quite a surprise for me ), after ply 15 I stopped
watching.
To add another prog that solves this easy draw ( for a human ) in less than a
second Shredder 3 at ply 5 , score 0.00 . But it is fine to be more clever than
crafty once anyway :)
Greetings from Berlin.
Pete
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