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Subject: Re: give up

Author: Mark Young

Date: 15:30:57 08/09/99

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On August 09, 1999 at 17:04:23, Robert Hyatt wrote:

>On August 09, 1999 at 14:22:49, walter irvin wrote:
>
>>On August 09, 1999 at 09:46:17, Christopher R. Dorr wrote:
>>
>>>Are you the Walter Irvin with a USCF rating of 1616? Or the Walter Irvin with a
>>>USCF rating of 1250? If so, it is totally inconceivable that you are even
>>>*remotely near* the strength of any of the top programs. I know...I am a USCF
>>>Master (rated 500+ points higher than you), and I am not even near them.
>>>
>>>You were on here several months ago talking about how you had the best program
>>>in the world, etc. But you refused to allow me to play it. You made an
>>>outrageous claim then, and you are making an outrageous claim now.
>>>
>>>If you expect *anyone* here to give any credence at all to anything you say (and
>>>not just about this...literally any comment you make will be considered trivial
>>>unless you validate yourself on this one) you must prove your statement.
>>>
>>>Bob Hyatt offered to let you play Crafty on ICC. If you can beat Crafty (without
>>>the aid of a computer on your end), then your statement may have some merit. But
>>>unless you do this, you will be considered some random crank, who just logs on
>>>every once in a while, and who obviously knows so little about computer and
>>>chess that his statements should be ignored completely.
>>>
>>>
>>>WHy do you post such statements if you are unwilling to back them up? They fly
>>>in the face of *all* evidence and experience. You must realize that they appear
>>>very peculiar to say the least.
>>>
>>>Chris Dorr
>>>USCF Master
>>well  the thing is i have played many more games vs computers than you , does
>>not mean i better than you , maybe better against computers . its a possibility
>>.plus my true rating is not 1616 ,1250 ect they are ratings based on see below
>>posting .i think im some where around 2100 or so .but that will change as i have
>>been practicing 6 or 7 hr. day every day .my new financial situation allows me
>>to devote much more time than ever before .plus i will be able to compete a
>>whole lot more .plus i have something you need to be champion i believe in
>>myself 100%.
>>>
>
>If your real rating is 1600, then you really don't stand a snowball's chance
>in you-know-where of beating a computer program on decent hardware, without
>taking back moves or seeing analysis.  It just won't happen...

I am glad you brought up the point about seeing the computers analysis. I know
many players at the club who claimed they could beat or draw one of the top
programs. In all the cases I have seen they could only do this if they could see
the programs thinking lines. After I "showed them how to turn off the analysis."
It was crush city for the programs, but of course they claim they never looked
at the analysis when they were playing.:) In my state the best player is IM Mike
Brooks, and we has just a hand full of masters and most of them a below 2300.
There is no doubt in my mind that the best programs could beat or crush any play
in my state at any over the board time control.

>
>
>
>>>
>>>On August 08, 1999 at 21:21:14, walter irvin wrote:
>>>
>>>>i just dont think it can be done .no one can build a chess program that i can
>>>>not beat, not even me .hiarcs was doing good the first 3 or 4 games , now easy
>>>>money .this coming from a under 2000 elo player .if i find it easy gm should
>>>>find it childs play ?????????



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