Author: blass uri
Date: 03:22:22 01/23/00
Go up one level in this thread
On January 23, 2000 at 02:51:55, Amir Ban wrote: >On January 23, 2000 at 01:19:04, Bruce Moreland wrote: > >>On January 22, 2000 at 17:47:28, Robert Hyatt wrote: >> >>>They were searching about 100K nodes per second, according to Hsu. yes, they >>>do a lot more in their eval than what they could do if they ran on a PC and >>>searched 100K nodes per second (this match was in 1995-96 time frame, which >>>would have been roughly pentium pro 200 level machines for the PC side). But >>>regardless... if they searched only 100K, and they dominated the commercial >>>programs as they have been reporting (again, 38-2 was reported) that says that >>>whatever they are doing is pretty good... as programs like fritz are way over >>>100K on a P6/200... >> >>I think that those matches should be absolutely ignored because they weren't >>played under controlled conditions, and they weren't played in public. >> >>There are enough places that mistakes could have been made, and enough estimates >>that could be off, that for these data to be accepted upon faith is completely >>ridiculous. >> >>The machine has existed for some time, and has had ample opportunity to display >>its talents on the internet and in international tournaments. However, we have >>zero published games between a "full strength" DB Jr and any other program. >> >>For all I know it is a wonderful machine. However, if anyone wants me to accept >>that it is a wonderful machine, it is going to have to come out and play some >>games, the idea that it should play all of its computer vs computer games behind >>locked doors and that we should simply accept the results is just bullshit. >> >>Sorry. >> >>bruce > >The results can be disregarded on these grounds of course, but it's also true >that the results, as reported, can be dismissed as being in contradiction to the >DB/DT public record, and to common sense in general. > >Amir I agree. I remember that 38:2 was claimed for the real deep blue Junior(20,000,000 nodes/second) and that the claim about the slowed down deep blue Junior was 10:0 10:0 also seems to be illogical but 38:2 is more illogical. My opinion is that it was better for hsu to hide all the results of not public games even if they are truth becuase I believe that the result of telling the stories about 38:2 and 10:0 is that most people simply do not believe him and he could expect it. If he can do something that is clearly better than the commercial than he should translate his program to personal computers. Even if it is 10 times slower then he can get something similiar to the something that beat the commercials 38:2 or 10:0 thanks to hardware improvemant of today's computers(I think that pentiumIII500*4 is almost 10 times faster than p200) and even if it can win Deep Junior only 25:15 at tournament time control instead of 38:2 against the old programs on p200MMX then he is going to sell it. If he does not do it then he can expect everyone not to believe him. Uri
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