Author: Dave Gomboc
Date: 23:45:49 02/12/00
Go up one level in this thread
On February 13, 2000 at 01:43:27, Albert Silver wrote: >On February 12, 2000 at 23:22:54, Vincent Vega wrote: > >>On February 12, 2000 at 01:44:27, Albert Silver wrote: >> >>>Of course. You state that the interfaces of all chess programs are ridiculously >>>poor on a number of levels yet give no explanation as to what your complaints >>>are. Instead you put forward that you are an expert in interfaces having just >>>finished a complex one just now. The only problem is that your position as an >>>authority (as no arguments were presented) resides right now on a recently >>>finished project made by a movie character name working in a mystery company. >>>That's quite a magic trick. Also, you now sweep it under the carpet by hinting >>>that this is in fact but one of _many_ projects. Fine. Are they all secret as >>>well? >> >>Let me repeat what I said before, if you can't bring yourself to believe what I >>said that's your problem. Sorry, I don't care. > >That isn't, and never was, the issue. If you are going to declare yourself as an >authority on anything, then you must also be prepared to back that up. If not, >say nothing and merely present your arguments. I see no reason why I have to >take this on faith. > > >> >>>In the one instance you show the problems you perceive with commercial >>>interfaces (you had already said that amateur ones need not concern themselves >>>being free), you choose an amateur program, and make a large list full of >>>problems that don't exist in today's commercial programs. Take the top >>>commercial programs, and show me what is so terrible that they should hide their >>>reddened face in shame. >>> >>Again, as I said before, I chose Winboard because it was very often highly >>praised, also in this thread. Want to see a critique of Fritz 6? You got it. >> >>Help is weak - index should be comprehensive (for example if I need to type >>"chess clocks,” but I should be able to type “time” or “clock” and get there), >>HTML help is used (requiring users to install IE, when some may not want to) and >>none of its extra features are utilized, no context-sensitive help – >>unbelievable omission, toolbars can only be moved around by clicking on what in >>other programs is a sizing bar – doesn’t make sense, toolbars cannot be >>undocked, toolbars can only be docked to the top frame, standard menu bar name >>is Window_s_, not Window, mouse cursor should be changed to hourglass when a >>lengthy operation is performed – hint for example, analog clocks are very ugly – >>antialiasing anyone?, why are there scroll bars in engine output window when >>there is nothing there – contrary to every style guide, chessboard window takes >>way to long to redraw, hiding a pane and then bringing it back changes its size, >>why can I drag a piece I can’t move?, why can’t I change time by clicking on the >>clock?, time controls are very weak – can you even set separate time controls?, >>time per move window doesn’t even say that it’s seconds and is unable to convert >>minutes, database window is _made_ for a tree view instead an antiquated >>DOS-like window is used, why no drag-and-drop of pieces in 3D?, why such a slow >>performance in 3D?, why no mouse-based 3D view controls?, when inputting >>keyboard moves board squares should obviously be highlighted, no tooltips on >>toolbars in engine match, undo, redo, find, copy, and paste keys all go against >>Windows standards, why is Position Setup in File -> New?, having to scroll the >>list boxes when not necessary – for example in Board Design window, Proportion >>and other sliders in Board Design need some points of reference or instant >>feedback, right-clicking on the board brings up Board Design instead of a >>standard Win 9X pop-up menu, when time runs out a window that pops up gives a >>message that says: “Time” – nothing about who won, next to mutually exclusive >>menu choices (like 2D Board and 3D Board) should be a radio buttons, not >>checkmarks, why does clicking on an empty square change cursor to a hand? – >>doesn’t make sense, why can I drag a piece of the wrong side?, why aren’t >>keyboard shortcuts set to a consistent scheme? (to get a new opening book >>Ctrl+Alt+Shift+F11 – a joke), I can move around all the windows except the board >>window – why?, overuse of multiple level menus when they are badly done in >>Windows (require too much mouse precision), no distinction between commands and >>on/off switches in menu and toolbars. >> >>I’m basing this on a demo version so I can’t criticize a lot of unavailable >>options ;-) >>Note that very few of these are personal preferences – almost all are widely >>recognized standards, followed in thousands of other programs, or common sense >>things. And I think Fritz 6 interface is good compared to others :-) Waiting >>for my check from Chessbase... > >I'll answer this later as I have no time now (it's 4:40 am here in Rio). One >question though: what is your definition of an interface? There were a number of >things that seemed to have nothing to do with what I believe to be an interface >issue (ex: slow drawing of 3D pieces). Also, some things seem completely >subjective and I cannot regard as making it a poor interface for as much (ex: >using radio buttons instead of checkboxes). > > Albert Silver I have to agree with V.V. on both of these points. Slow display of pieces is a UI issue: simply put, the visual feedback is sluggish. In fact, I can't imagine what else one would consider it to be (other than a UI issue). Radio buttons are designed for mutually exclusive options, and check boxes are used when more than one option may be concurrently selected. This isn't a matter of preference, this has been a UI standard for well over a decade. It is important to use appropriate visual affordances. I haven't seen the Fritz demo in action, I am just saying that if these problems exist, they are legit UI flaws. Dave
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