Author: blass uri
Date: 00:14:06 02/26/00
Go up one level in this thread
On February 26, 2000 at 02:55:55, Derrick Williams wrote:
>On February 26, 2000 at 02:27:33, blass uri wrote:
>
>>On February 25, 2000 at 21:04:06, Jorge Pichard wrote:
>>
>>>There is no questions that any of these programs (Deep Junior 6.0 Fritz 6.0
>>>Shredder 4.0 Nimzo 2000 and Rebel 10) can easily beat Xie Jun, which is only
>>>rated 2545 by FIDE;
>> Plus her style is just perfect to pit her against any of
>>>these computer Chess Programs. I don't believe that she will change her style in
>>>just two weeks and adjust to the Anticomputer Style, and even if she does
>>>decides to play positionally instead of tactically, DJ has sufficient positional
>>>knowledge to beat even a Great GM like Adams, which is among the 10 best in the
>>>world.
>>
>>I think that you forget that the game was one hour per game and that adams
>>probably did not buy deep Junior and played many games against it before the
>>match because he had to worry also about other games.
>>
>>I read that adams played in the regular way that he plays against humans and it
>>is a mistake.
>>
>>Deep Junior can be a weak player but you need to play the right opening to
>>discover it.
>>
>> Just remember that Anand develops his Anticomputer style over the las 10
>>>years and Rebel managed to draw against him in tournament regulation time two
>>>years ago.
>>
>>1)Anand did not play anti-computer style in the games against Rebel.
>>2)If the target is not to win but only to get a draw then it is clearly easier.
>>Remember that 2176 player got a draw against Fritz6 by trading the pieces for an
>>endgame.
>>
>>2300 player also could draw against shredder by trading the pieces.
>>
>>Deep Junior is better than fritz6 but the difference between Xie Jun and 2176 is
>>clearly bigger.
>>
>>I believe that if Xie Jun is going to play for a draw in every game and to play
>>for a win only if she discovers that the computer blundered then she has good
>>chances for 3:3 or even 3.5:2.5
>>
>>Uri
>
>
> So then with your way of thinking , every loss by a computer can be explained
>as either the GM does not know how to play anti-computer chess, or he Did not
>play enough games against the machine, I guess I could say the same thing about
>me and kasparov, if I play him enough games I could learn to beat him, or If I
>learn the weakness in his opening play , i could destroy him. The problem is the
>grandmasters have been looking for these weakness for years, without sucess. The
>problem is with the "if" word, if my grandma had wings she could fly.
No, they are not looking for these weaknesses for years.
They usually play against humans and not against computers.
Here are some weak games of Junior6(4 games from the ssdf list and one game
against shredder4 from enrique's tournament) when Junior6 forgot to castle.
She knows more than me about chess and she can find more weakness of Junior if
she learn Junior's games.
All the games I post are public games and xie can learn them.
I do not think that in most of the cases the GM really learned the games of the
opponent but in this case Xie knows about the match for at least some weeks and
If the games against deep Junior are the only important games of her in the near
future she can reallly learn Deep Junior's weaknesses
Amir Ban also can learn Junior's weaknesses but it is more easy to find
weaknesses then to fix them.
Every program has different weaknesses and I do not think that in most of the
cases the GM's know about the program's weaknesses.
[Event "Schackdatormatch"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2000.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "King 2.0 ARM2 30"]
[Black "Junior 6.0 K6_2 450"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "B22"]
[WhiteElo "2290"]
[BlackElo "2735"]
[PlyCount "157"]
[EventDate "2000.??.??"]
1. e4 {90MB, jbook.ctg. AMD K6-2 450 MHz} 1... c5 2. c3 e6 3. d4 d5 4. exd5
exd5 5. Nf3 Nc6 6. Bb5 Bd6 7. O-O Nf6 8. Qe2+ Kf8 {0.33/16} 9. dxc5 Bxc5 {
0.34/17} 10. Bf4 Bg4 {0.29/16} 11. Nbd2 Qb6 {0.31/16} 12. b4 Bxb4 {0.37/14} 13.
Bxc6 Bxc3 {0.33/16} 14. Bb5 Bxa1 {0.34/16} 15. Rxa1 a6 {0.42/16} 16. Bd3 Re8 {
0.44/15} 17. Be3 Qd6 {0.41/16} 18. Nb3 Kg8 {0.35/16} 19. Rc1 b5 {0.45/16} 20.
Nbd4 Qa3 {0.50/16} 21. Rc7 Bh5 {0.66/16} 22. Qc2 h6 {0.86/17} 23. Ra7 Bxf3 {
1.49/16} 24. Nxf3 Qd6 {1.51/16} 25. a4 Ne4 {1.57/15} 26. axb5 axb5 {1.84/16}
27. Bxb5 Rf8 {1.84/15} 28. Rd7 Qb4 {2.11/17} 29. Bd3 Nf6 {1.69/17} 30. Rc7 Qd6
{1.97/17} 31. Rc6 Qb8 {1.95/17} 32. Rc7 Qa8 {2.09/17} 33. Bd4 Qa3 {2.26/18} 34.
Ra7 Qd6 {2.36/17} 35. Ra6 Qd8 {2.50/17} 36. Bxf6 gxf6 {2.71/18} 37. Qa4 Re8 {
2.63/17} 38. Qg4+ Kf8 {2.19/3} 39. Qf4 Re6 {2.99/17} 40. Rxe6 fxe6 {3.01/17}
41. Ne5 f5 {3.08/16} 42. Bxf5 Kg7 {3.14/16} 43. Bxe6 Qe7 {3.14/17} 44. Bxd5 Re8
{3.25/17} 45. Qg3+ Qg5 {3.13/17} 46. f4 Qxg3 {3.26/20} 47. hxg3 Rd8 {3.35/20}
48. Bf3 Rc8 {3.37/23} 49. Kf2 Rc3 {3.29/21} 50. g4 Kf6 {3.15/20} 51. Bd5 Ke7 {
3.15/18} 52. Ng6+ Kf6 {3.16/19} 53. f5 Rc1 {3.00/18} 54. Ke3 Rc8 {3.03/18} 55.
Kf4 Rd8 {3.13/20} 56. Ke4 Rb8 {3.09/20} 57. Bc4 Rb4 {3.03/17} 58. Ne5 Rb2 {
3.07/21} 59. g3 Rg2 {3.14/19} 60. Nd7+ Ke7 {3.19/17} 61. Kf3 Rd2 {3.36/18} 62.
Ne5 Rc2 {3.51/19} 63. Be6 Kf6 {3.69/21} 64. Nd7+ Ke7 {3.69/23} 65. Kf4 Rf2+ {
2.94/20} 66. Ke5 Re2+ {2.93/20} 67. Kd4 Rd2+ {2.93/20} 68. Ke3 Rg2 {2.84/21}
69. Nc5 Rxg3+ {2.90/21} 70. Kf4 Rg1 {2.91/21} 71. Ne4 Ra1 {3.05/22} 72. Ke5 Rc1
{3.63/21} 73. f6+ Kf8 {4.38/23} 74. Kf5 Rc2 {6.18/22} 75. Kg6 Rc6 {6.48/21} 76.
Bb3 Rc1 {8.36/20} 77. Kxh6 Rf1 {8.94/23} 78. g5 Rh1+ {9.25/24} 79. Kg6 1-0
[Event "Schackdatormatch"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2000.??.??"]
[Round "?"]
[White "Junior 6.0 K6_2 450"]
[Black "King 2.0 ARM2 30"]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "D12"]
[WhiteElo "2735"]
[BlackElo "2290"]
[PlyCount "127"]
[EventDate "2000.??.??"]
1. d4 {90MB, jbook.ctg. AMD K6-2 450 MHz} 1... c6 2. c4 d5 3. Nf3 Nf6 4. e3 Bf5
{*} 5. Nc3 e6 6. Nh4 Bg4 7. Qb3 b6 8. h3 Bh5 9. g4 {*} 9... Ne4 10. Nxe4 {
-0.09/16} 10... Qxh4 11. gxh5 {-0.03/17} 11... dxe4 12. Rg1 {0.05/20} 12... Nd7
13. Qa4 {0.28/17} 13... Rc8 14. Rg4 {0.23/17} 14... Qxh5 15. Qxa7 {-0.04/18}
15... f5 16. Rg2 {0.27/16} 16... g6 17. Bd2 {0.42/18} 17... Bd6 18. Bc3 {
0.33/16} 18... Ke7 19. a4 {0.27/16} 19... Rc7 20. Qa6 {0.30/17} 20... Rb8 21.
a5 {0.20/17} 21... e5 22. axb6 {0.24/15} 22... Rxb6 23. Qa4 {0.12/17} 23...
exd4 24. exd4 {0.00/15} 24... c5 25. Qd1 {-0.21/14} 25... Qh6 26. Qd2 {-0.26/15
} 26... Bf4 27. Qd1 {-0.58/16} 27... Rd6 28. d5 {-0.12/16} 28... Rb7 29. Rg1 {
-0.44/16} 29... Ne5 30. Be2 {-1.05/17} 30... Qxh3 31. Ra3 {-1.36/15} 31... e3
32. Bxe5 {-1.51/14} 32... exf2+ 33. Kxf2 {-1.51/3} 33... Qh4+ 34. Kg2 {-1.79/16
} 34... Qh2+ 35. Kf1 {-1.91/18} 35... Bxe5 36. Rg2 {-1.91/16} 36... Qh1+ 37.
Rg1 {-2.03/18} 37... Qh6 38. Bf3 {-2.01/15} 38... Rxb2 39. Rh1 {-2.06/14} 39...
Qf4 40. Rxh7+ {-2.09/14} 40... Kf6 41. Qe1 {-3.18/16} 41... Qxc4+ 42. Be2 {
-2.85/17} 42... Qf4+ 43. Rf3 {-2.97/17} 43... Qe4 44. Re3 {-2.64/16} 44... Qxe3
45. Qh4+ {-2.73/19} 45... Qg5 46. Rf7+ {-2.73/18} 46... Kxf7 47. Qxg5 {-2.71/16
} 47... Rb1+ 48. Kg2 {-2.91/16} 48... Bd4 49. Qh6 {-2.93/15} 49... Rb2 50. Kf1
{-3.48/19} 50... Rb4 51. Qc1 {-3.37/16} 51... g5 52. Bh5+ {-3.73/15} 52... Kf6
53. Qa3 {-4.17/17} 53... Rb1+ 54. Ke2 {-4.17/18} 54... Rxd5 55. Qa6+ {-4.28/14}
55... Ke5 56. Qc6 {-4.32/16} 56... g4 57. Bf7 {-4.27/16} 57... Rd6 58. Qc7 {
-4.41/18} 58... Rbb6 59. Kf1 {-4.53/18} 59... Be3 60. Ke2 {-4.31/15} 60... Rb2+
61. Ke1 {-5.26/18} 61... Rbd2 62. Be8 {-6.00/16} 62... Kf4 63. Ba4 {-9.70/19}
63... g3 64. Bc6 {-16.32/19} 0-1
[Event "Cadaques Tournament"]
[Site "Cadaques"]
[Date "2000.01.01"]
[Round "2"]
[White "Shredder 4"]
[Black "Junior 6.0"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "B54"]
[Annotator "Junior 6"]
[PlyCount "62"]
[EventDate "2000.01.01"]
{183MB, jbook.ctg. PIII-500
} 1. e4 {0} 1... c5 {0} 2. Nf3 {1} 2... e6 {0} 3.
d4 {2} 3... cxd4 {0} 4. Nxd4 {1} 4... Nc6 {0} 5. Nc3 {1} 5... d6 {0} 6. Be3 {1}
6... a6 {0} 7. f4 {last book move 1} 7... Bd7 {0.16/15 92} 8. Be2 {82} 8... b5
{0.19/14 71} 9. Nxc6 {90} 9... Bxc6 {0.17/13 27} 10. Qd4 {126} 10... Nf6 {
0.23/16 2} 11. O-O {54} 11... Qc7 {0.24/15 2} 12. a4 {71} 12... bxa4 {
0.12/14 223} 13. e5 {6} 13... dxe5 {0.00/14 103} 14. fxe5 {63} 14... Nd7 {
0.05/14 76} 15. Nxa4 {6} 15... Nxe5 {0.09/14 91} 16. Nc5 {86} 16... Bxc5 {
0.08/15 2} 17. Qxc5 {19} 17... Nd7 {-0.05/15 194} 18. Qa3 {1} 18... a5 {
-0.16/14 148} 19. Rf2 {109} 19... Nf6 {-0.15/14 46} 20. Rd1 {83} 20... a4 {
-0.23/14 84} 21. Bd4 {128} 21... Ne4 {-0.27/14 44} 22. Rff1 {43} 22... e5 {
-0.25/14 113} 23. Be3 {54} 23... Nf6 {-0.07/14 41} 24. Bc5 {91} 24... Nd7 {
0.01/14 91} 25. Rf2 {79} 25... Qb7 {0.11/13 44} 26. Qc3 {103} 26... f6 {
0.68/13 63} 27. Bb4 {48} 27... Rb8 {0.62/13 155} 28. Bd6 {73} 28... Ra8 {
1.05/15 2} 29. Qc4 {97} 29... Kd8 {1.65/15 2} 30. Qf7 {108} 30... g6 {
2.25/13 35} 31. Rxf6 {202} 31... Re8 {3.81/14 262} 1-0
[Event "SSDF (J6AMD-R8MMX)"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2000.??.??"]
[Round "37"]
[White "COMP Junior 6.0 AMD K6_2, 450MHz"]
[Black "COMP Rebel8 MMX200"]
[Result "0-1"]
[ECO "E12"]
[PlyCount "137"]
[EventDate "2000.??.??"]
1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 e6 3. Nf3 b6 4. Nc3 Bb7 5. a3 d5 6. Bg5 Be7 7. e3 O-O 8. Rc1 c5
9. cxd5 cxd4 10. Bxf6 Bxf6 11. Nxd4 exd5 12. Bb5 a6 13. Ba4 b5 14. Bb3 Bxd4 15.
exd4 Re8+ 16. Kf1 Qg5 17. h4 Qf5 18. Rh3 Nd7 19. Qf3 Qxf3 20. Rxf3 Nb6 21. g3
Nc4 22. Bxc4 dxc4 23. Re3 Kf8 24. Rd1 Rad8 25. d5 Re7 26. Rxe7 Kxe7 27. f4 f5
28. Re1+ Kd6 29. Re6+ Kc5 30. Re7 Bxd5 31. Rxg7 Bf3 32. Rc7+ Kb6 33. Rxh7 Rd2
34. h5 Rxb2 35. h6 Rh2 36. Kg1 Rg2+ 37. Kf1 Rxg3 38. Re7 Bc6 39. h7 Rh3 40. Na2
a5 41. Ke2 Kc5 42. Ra7 Kd4 43. Kf2 Be4 44. Rd7+ Bd5 45. Ke2 Rh2+ 46. Kd1 Kc5
47. Ra7 Bf3+ 48. Kc1 Kd4 49. Re7 Be4 50. Rd7+ Ke3 51. Nc3 b4 52. Nxe4 fxe4 53.
axb4 axb4 54. f5 b3 55. Rc7 Kd3 56. Rd7+ Kc3 57. h8=Q+ Rxh8 58. Kd1 b2 59. Rb7
b1=Q+ 60. Rxb1 Kd3 61. Ke1 Rh1+ 62. Kf2 Rxb1 63. Kg3 c3 64. Kf4 c2 65. f6 Rb5
66. Kg4 c1=Q 67. Kh3 Qh1+ 68. Kg4 Qf3+ 69. Kh4 0-1
[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2000.??.??"]
[Round "16"]
[White "Nimzo '99 P200MMX"]
[Black "Junior 6.0 K6_2"]
[Result "1-0"]
[ECO "B87"]
[PlyCount "159"]
[EventDate "2000.??.??"]
1. e4 c5 2. Nf3 d6 3. d4 cxd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 a6 6. Bc4 e6 7. Bb3 b5 8. O-O
Be7 9. Qf3 Qb6 10. Be3 Qb7 11. Qg3 Nbd7 12. Rfe1 Nc5 13. Nf5 exf5 14. Qxg7 Be6
15. Qxh8+ Kd7 16. Qg7 Rg8 17. Qh6 Nxb3 18. axb3 Rg6 19. Qf4 Rg4 20. Qf3 fxe4
21. Qd1 Rg8 22. Bd4 Bg4 23. Qd2 Bf3 24. g3 Rg4 25. b4 h5 26. Ra5 h4 27. Rea1 e3
28. Qxe3 Bh1 29. Kf1 Qg2+ 30. Ke1 Nd5 31. Qd3 Qf3 32. Qxf3 Bxf3 33. Nxd5 Bxd5
34. c3 Bb7 35. Ke2 Rg6 36. Kd3 Re6 37. b3 Bd8 38. R5a2 Be4+ 39. Kd2 Bb7 40. Re1
Rxe1 41. Kxe1 h3 42. Ke2 f5 43. Ke3 Bg5+ 44. f4 Bd8 45. c4 Kc7 46. Bc3 Be7 47.
Ra5 Kc6 48. Bg7 Bd8 49. Ra1 Bc8 50. Bf8 Bb7 51. Rd1 Bc7 52. Rd2 Bc8 53. Kd3 Kd7
54. Kc3 Kc6 55. Rd1 Bd7 56. Ra1 Bc8 57. Re1 Bd8 58. Kd2 bxc4 59. bxc4 Bd7 60.
Bg7 Kc7 61. Kc3 Kc6 62. Re2 Kb7 63. Ra2 Be6 64. Kd4 Bf7 65. Re2 Kc6 66. Kc3 Kb6
67. Bd4+ Kc7 68. Ra2 Kb7 69. b5 a5 70. b6 Ka6 71. Rb2 Kb7 72. Rb5 Be6 73. Rxa5
Bc8 74. Ra7+ Kc6 75. Rh7 Bxb6 76. Bxb6 Kxb6 77. Rxh3 Kc7 78. Rh7+ Kd8 79. Rh8+
Ke7 80. Rxc8 1-0
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Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700
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