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Subject: Re: Shredder 5 - Deep Fritz , 2 hours/move. Shredder played 33. f5 -1.19/16

Author: Bertil Eklund

Date: 15:47:45 03/29/01

Go up one level in this thread


On March 29, 2001 at 18:13:02, Ralf Elvsén wrote:

>On March 29, 2001 at 14:28:29, Uri Blass wrote:
>
>>On March 29, 2001 at 12:30:23, Ralf Elvsén wrote:
>>
>
>>>
>>>See my reply to Bertil below. The program might know it is losing
>>>but is forced to play the move anyway. Not the kind of rules I like.
>>>
>>>Ralf
>>
>>In tournament time control it may play the same move because it even has not
>>enough time to know that it is losing so it does not change the fact that the
>>level of game is higher than tournament time control.
>>
>>You can also ask the same question about a regular tournament game.
>>If you see at move 40 that you are losing and you have only few seconds to the
>>time control.
>
>The argument is moot since that is a singular event. Besides, if a program
>has as a part of its time management to not save up panic time before
>the time control it should be punished for it, and it will be in a regular
>game. The quality of time mangement for the two programs in Lykkes game
>is short circuited by this kind of "time control".
>>
>>I will prefer to play a move that I have not enough time to analyze in this case
>
>What do you mean? Play the move you think looks bad but you don't know
>how bad, or pick another move you don't know how good/bad it is?
>If you mean the last alternative, the programs aren't even doing this
>I guess.
>
>Let me try once more to explain what I mean: If Lykke for every 5th
>move produced a random integer between 1 and 64 and from that got
>a square and, if that square was occupied, removed that piece (not
>a king), it would introduce a random element which has nothing to do
>with chess. And it wouldn't favor one program over another. But to
>me it would make the game less interesting.
>
>Now he is forcing the program to play a move when it is in a situation
>where the move first in its movelist might be considered poor (or it is
>just failing low). This is also a non-chess element in my opinion, since
>chess is played with a time constraint, but also with a freedom to
>allocate the time as you see fit, and I bet this is the assumption of
>the programmer when he designes his search.
>
>So, it's a random element added to the game. And what are the benefits?
>Just the small conveniance to be able to report one move EXACTLY every
>2nd hour.
>
>Doesn't make sense to me.
>
>Ralf
>>
>>Uri

Hi!

And your suggestion is? If you have one computer and tries to play a sort of
correspondence-game. Isn't it reasonable to decide a time for each move in
example 2 or 24hours? Who should decide what is a fail low/high, maybee one
program fails low two or three times in a row and the solution is say 100h away.
This is the rules for this match and the result is nothing else then what I
believe is an interesting game and probably of higher class then an ordinary
tournament-game.

Bertil



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