Author: Chessfun
Date: 18:09:23 05/29/01
Go up one level in this thread
On May 29, 2001 at 13:02:43, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: > round 3 : Ferret - diep 1-0 > >Diep played Najdorf and got itself a splendid position despite that >the number of variations in my tournament book is not so big. >However bad luck struck for diep this time. Something went wrong >with king safety and diep walked its king into the center. Now despite >that Ferret kept on playing nullmoves and my score went high. So >i assume somewhere there a penalty must have had a plus instead of >a minus. Perhaps i'll figure it out tonight. Anyway. Playing with a rook >less lost quick for DIEP though. Complete crush after playing with that >rook less. Great debug info though! > round 8 : crafty - diep 0-1 >But to get to the game. Same line as against ferret up to 12th move >of black. I was pretty amazed >actually. Any automatic generated book would have played in poisened pawn >the Qd2 move allowing me to get a REAL poisened pawn by taking on b2. > >However crafty played Nb3. I DEFINITELY like to know why, because a >posting of Bob: > Posted by Robert Hyatt (Profile) on May 28, 2001 at 00:46:07: > > " > [snip] > > > > >It shouldn't be the case that someone signs a contract with > >ChessBase and then > >sighs with relief because they know they're going to gain > >an extra couple of > >points at the next tournament, because they can use > >opening book technology > >shared by all of the Chessbase products. > > > >bruce > > I won't disagree. But it is already happening. If I ever play > in what I consider an important event, it will be one of my > goals to take some sort of evasive action, book-wise. > Or take my main goal: to make hand-tuned books > obsolete. I believe that is possible over time. > I'm going to try to do it." > >Oh well obviously crafty isn't playing with a non-hand tuned thing here, >because any automatic generated book will see that after > e4 c5 nf3 d6 d4 cd nd4 nf6 nc3 a6 bg5 e6 f4 qb6 > a) 8.Nb3 has a bad score for white > b) 8.Qd2 is played way more times and has a better score for > white. According to DeepFritz.ctg the chance of 8. Nb3 is 15.2% and only actually has a performance difference of -6 2547 v 2553. I never checked other books but would assume similar percentages. >But main factor is that Qd2 is at least 10 times more played as Nb3, >which will render any thought of playing Nb3 useless! Not useless just less. >Anyway my surprise became even BIGGER, when the exact same line as >against ferret came onto the board. Only at move 13 a different move >was selected, probably even better as the book move played by ferret. > >If that's non-hand tuned then i'll eat my hat! What makes you think that 13. Qh3 is such a good move? Ferret's 13. a3 looks better. >Anyway, DIEP frightened its programmer here by quickly castling, but after >a few nullmoves of crafty, things were very clear in favour for diep then. I would like to have read more of your thoughts on both these games. However great reading your thoughts on all matches !. Some of your comments though as the following I feel should be a little less open or maybe spirited. >2400 7814059 Kaan J.E.F. M 1245* 14- > >Now compare that with a 1245 rated 'born loser' Jan Kaan who >played in I-CSVN with Yace with his own home made book. Of >course that book doesn't make a chance, not to mention that >it lost strategically in every line for Yace! > >Because that is the bitter reality. Now you don't need too much rating >yourself to make a good book, as making a book is completely different >from playing chess in a tournament. > >However, some strategical insight is at least needed to make a book. >I know some 1200 rated KNSB players who play correspondence chess and >manage to get good openings positions there, but of course Jan Kaan >is completely chanceless against guys who DEFINITELY know strategics >a bit like Pesce who made a book for Yace and Pharaon. > > 105872 Pesce, Carlos ARG 2045 0 19.04.61 > >I'm really amazed that programmer of Yace allowed Jan1245 to delete >at home the very good Pesce book and replace it by a Jan Kaan >"automatic generated beginners book". > >Because strategically Jan Kaan is of course infinitely and with >induction to forever worse than Pesce, who is at a chess level that >he might outbook any IM and some GMs also. > >'Kaan automatic generated beginner books' What details do you have on the Kaan book to call it a beginner book. First you say "Because that is the bitter reality. Now you don't need too much rating yourself to make a good book, as making a book is completely different from playing chess in a tournament." Then critique the book, one which you probably haven't analyzed. Just seems like a personal attack to me. Even the comments about Patzer I thought were harsh at times. However as usual your posts do make for a fun read ! Sarah.
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