Computer Chess Club Archives


Search

Terms

Messages

Subject: Re: Why the sudden urge to proclaim programs as GMs?

Author: Chris Carson

Date: 06:45:37 06/26/01

Go up one level in this thread


On June 26, 2001 at 09:35:45, Martin Schubert wrote:

>On June 26, 2001 at 09:20:46, Chris Carson wrote:
>
>>On June 26, 2001 at 09:06:42, Andrew Williams wrote:
>>
>>>Over the last month, there have been a number of such huge arguments.
>>>I've always thought that it's a bit strange to get hung up on this
>>>question. Five years ago, it was clear that the best micro programs
>>>were not at GM strength. And presumably if you wait five years, PC
>>>programs will have proven beyond any doubt that they are at GM strength.
>>>Surely the time we happen to be living in is the best and most enjoyable,
>>>because we're perhaps seeing a moment of transition between these positions.
>>>Why then the need to convince anybody of anything when you can just sit
>>>there and be proved right by waiting? Is there some particular benefit to
>>>being able to say that PC programs are GMs *now*?
>>>
>>>Andrew
>>
>>I do not care if they are or they are not GM's.  I do care what ELO strength
>>they are.
>>
>The problem with the ELO is that there's the danger to compare things you can't
>compare. ELO is one number for chess between humans. Computers play totally
>different chess. So the ELO you get for a computer depends on what kind of games
>you play. If the players are experienced in playing computers.
>Of course if you let a top program play against players which are not very
>experienced playing against computers you'll get a good rating. You wouldn't get
>such a good rating when letting the program play against more experienced
>players.
>A lot of people are very interested in ELO. But it's just one number! You can't
>put every knowledge about chess just in one number. So IMO it's far more
>interesting to ask where can computers help the humans and where can't they
>instead of just looking at one number.
>
>Martin
>
>
>>Why not determine what the strength is now?  I made a statement 2 years ago
>>about the strength on 500Mhz machines and was challenged to provide more than
>>one game to prove my point.  I did that.
>>
>>Why is it so important to wait 5 years?
>>
>>If it is not important to you.  Great, don't read the posts, I ignore a lot of
>>stuff on this board that is not important to me.  :)
>>
>>Best Regards,
>>Chris Carson

That is a good point.

ELO is the measure for performance.  That is what I am talking about, that is
what I have always said.  If you want to discuss something else such as "what
are the weakness of programs or program x" that is a good topic, adds
information, but is not part of the "are programs performaning at ELO 2600 or
higher level.

Best Regards,
Chris Carson



This page took 0 seconds to execute

Last modified: Thu, 15 Apr 21 08:11:13 -0700

Current Computer Chess Club Forums at Talkchess. This site by Sean Mintz.