Author: Enrique Irazoqui
Date: 15:22:41 06/16/98
Go up one level in this thread
On June 16, 1998 at 16:34:09, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: > >On June 16, 1998 at 13:03:47, Enrique Irazoqui wrote: > >>On June 16, 1998 at 10:34:46, Peter Herttrich wrote: >> >>>On June 15, 1998 at 15:00:08, Moritz Berger wrote: >>> >>>>On June 15, 1998 at 14:37:12, Ed Schröder wrote: >>>> >>>>>>Posted by Vincent Diepeveen on June 15, 1998 at 13:26:04: >>>>> >>>>>>It's just so that cg5 book is a little older than rebel9 book so logically >>>>>>rebel has been cooked against cg5. >>>>> >>>>>Wrong. >>>>> >>>>>As usual. >>>>> >>>>>Rebel books only contain hand typed opening moves from (printed) theory >>>>>books. >>>>> >>>>>- Ed - >>>> >>>>... and everybody knows that the G5 book contains several onions ... >>> >>>Ok, you take the book and i take the onions. >>>And i think this discussion will not guide to anything. >> >>I have to disagree. For the last year and a half Vincent claimed that Rebel >>books are full of killer lines and that this would be the reason of Rebel's good >>performance in the SSDF games. This discussion may serve a purpose if we clear >>this issue one way or another. So far we saw no proof at all of any cooks in >>Rebel books. If all Vincent has to show after 18 months is the lines he posted >>yesterday, then he has no grounds at all to sustain his accusation. >> >>Enrique > >You should be moderated Enrique for such a naive approach of chess >where people try to earn their money with. Moderated for being naive? :) >If a GM knows you fall for a trick then he'll play it. Definitely. >I'm not sure what a GM earns. > >When you sell tens of thousands of copies of chessprograms you can multiply >this with 100 dollar a copy, from which of course others get their part too. > >We see clearly that in games like soccer when the salary is higher, >the game gets tougher. > >My point is, why do guys like you Enrique still believe the opposite of >computer chess? I think it quite natural what the commercials are doing, >the only point i want to raise is why do so many people believe fairy tales? > >If you can win by cooking a line 20 times like Bob a post higher explains, >then learning is also not gonna help you. > >If you play around 1000 games every 2 weeks >(around 7 autoplayers * 14 days * 10 games an autoplayer every 24 hours; >all games i get from Jan Louwman are either 1 minute or 1.5 or 2 minutes >a move at K6, and 1.5 minutes a game makes up for 14 games every 24 >hours, when chopping off at 60 moves), then this means you play in 1 year >easily 25,000 games. That's a small subset of the tournament book, and >an even smaller subset of the games you play in SSDF. > >So as 26,000 games are covering ALL games you possibly could play in >SSDF, then i think we can talk about serious preparing against the >opponents. > >Get the numbers right Enrique, 25000 games a year, and as versions >tend to take a little longer than a year or sometimes way longer, just >think of it 25000 games? This is called book tuning: see what lines your program plays well and what lines it plays badly; play ones and avoid the others. Most commercial programmers tune their books endlessly. But you were not talking about tuning but about cooking: the inclusion of killer lines in the opening book. There is something more than a semantic difference between one and the other. In any case, I think that the killer line issue has been solved in practice by learners and wide books. Look at the games played by the SSDF and you will notice that killer lines have had much less of an impact this last year than before. Killer books are an old issue and in my opinion quite irrelevant by now. Enrique >>>Peter > >Vincent
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