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Subject: Re: How Flexible opinions are: DB and further

Author: Vincent Diepeveen

Date: 03:20:06 06/28/98

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>>I see that normal evaluation of DB is 8 clocks now and
>>only done 20% (!) of the cases.
>>
>>So they're kind of lazy evaluating. Didn't know it could be done in 80% of
>>the times, meaning that their window to lazy evaluate is quite small, meaning
>>that the *reach* of the evaluation is not big.
>>
>
>doesn't mean that at all.  You seem to be able to measure the mass of a
>rock, and compute the total number of atoms in the universe, without having
>a clue about anything else.

So you don't have arguments against. I already posted that.
This is the x-th clear evidence how stupid their eval is.

Lot of patterns in eval ==> huge deviation ==> huge window needed
to lazy cutoff (if you use lazy cutoffs).

Clear. simple. no discussion about.

Vincent

>>The more knowledge is in your evaluation, the bigger the terms can differ,
>>the wider the window that comes out of evaluation, the less you can
>>lazy evaluate. My window out of evaluation is usually around [-12 pawns;12pawns]
>>that's positional score, where usual the black score
>>compensates for say 11 pawns the 11 pawns of white (getting an evaluation
>>of 0 then), but sometimes this isn't the case, causing huge window
>>differences.
>>
>>Hyatt your turn. Better cut and never paste this, he he. this is the x-th
>>hint to that evaluation is not having that a depth.
>
>
>nope... it only shows ignorance of hardware.  And here's a hint:  the
>ignorance is *not* on my part.


>I see *nothing* that says an evaluation has to produce evaluations that
>are +/- 12.  But you need to read about Belle and the fast/slow evaluations
>before you write more.. then you'll understand what this is all about.

It seem that you have *no idea* about what a huge evaluation means.
It means for example you can't do a lazy evaluation like that.

I have chess computer compendium. And i did read about Belle in that book.

More interesting than that is the research of
Paradise. When i got (thanks!) that paper about Paradise i found
the nullmove idea was already implemented in Paradise in 1979.

I got amazed by the number of rules that were implemented.
Too bad that those were needed to search instead of evaluating.

>>Can some known lazy evaluators say what % of nodes they can do
>>lazy, and what window is needed to get 80%?

What window do you need to get 80%, and what window have you
set?

Vincent



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