Author: Dieter Buerssner
Date: 07:51:12 12/28/02
Go up one level in this thread
On December 28, 2002 at 04:07:08, Uri Blass wrote:
>How much time did you give yace to analyze every move for black and for white
>when you did it?
It depends, normally less than a minute when going forward. You can see the time
in the PGN. Don't assume, it was very clever done. More or less mechanically,
while I was reading the newspaper. There may also be some variants inside, that
don't make sense, and at some points, when going back, I had too little patience
and tried many alternatives, while it probably would have been faster, to just
wait. But at some points I had learned, that the same mate as befor will work
again (for example, when just a Q-side pawn was different). Giving too much time
when going forward, may yield in even more time need when going backward. When
no mate is seen yet, pruning is done. When a mate is seen (while going
backward), practically any pruning is disabled for Yace, and so the same depth
is not reached that fast. At the moment however the same depth must be reached
normally, to overwrite the old learned data. (For mate scores, this would not be
needed).
[Event "?"]
[Site "?"]
[Date "2002.12.28"]
[Round "?"]
[White "?"]
[Black "?"]
[Result "*"]
[SetUp "1"]
[FEN "b2r2kr/p1pqb1p1/1p5p/4p3/2P1N1P1/1P2Q3/P3P2P/4KRR1 b - -"]
1... Bh4+ {2:32m} 2. Rg3 {4s} (2. Qg3 {1:10m} Qd1+ {10s}
3. Kf2 {2s} Qd4+ {15s} 4. Kg2 {25s} Qxe4+ {1s}) 2... Qd1+
{13s} 3. Kf2 {5s} Rf8+ {33s} 4. Qf3 {10s} (4. Nf6+ {32s}
Rxf6+ {4s} 5. Qf3 {9s} Rxf3+ {3s} 6. exf3 {7s} Qxf3+ {8s})
4... Qd4+ {44s} 5. Kg2 {4s} (5. Ke1 {54s} Bxg3+ {1:17m}
(5... Rxf3 {16s} 6. exf3 {24s} (6. Rfxf3 {24s} Bxe4 {36s}
7. Rd3 {1:53m} Bxd3 {4s} 8. exd3 {7s} Bxg3+ {13s}) (6. Nf6+
{2:24m} gxf6 {1:23m}) 6... Bxe4 {25s} 7. Rf2 {39s} (7. fxe4
{30s} Kh7 {19s}) 7... Qa1+ {1:46m}) 6. Nxg3 {5s} (6. hxg3
{17s} Rxf3 {4s} 7. Rxf3 {13s} Bxe4 {7s} 8. Rf5 {27s} Kh7
{6s}) 6... Bxf3 {12s} 7. Rxf3 {9s} (7. exf3 {22s} e4 {47s}
8. Nxe4 {14s} (8. Ne2 {29s} Qa1+ {8s} 9. Kd2 {5s} Rd8+
{6s}) 8... Qe3+ {10s} 9. Kd1 {3s} Rd8+ {2s} 10. Kc2 {6s}
Qe2+ {10s} 11. Kc1 {7s} Qxf1+ {7s} 12. Kb2 {1s}) 7... Qg1+
{12s} 8. Nf1 {6s} (8. Kd2 {24s} Rxf3 {8s} 9. exf3 {6s} Kh7
{5s} 10. Ne4 {25s} Rd8+ {18s} 11. Kc3 {20s} (11. Kc2 {57s}
Qg2+ {26s}) 11... a5 {6s}) (8. Rf1 {18s} Rxf1+ {10s}
9. Nxf1 {4s} Kh7 {18s}) 8... e4 {7s} 9. Rxf8+ {10s} (9. Rf5
{44s} Rxf5 {5s} 10. gxf5 {3s} e3 {9s}) (9. Kd2 {2:24m} exf3
{4s}) 9... Kxf8 {1s} 10. e3 {16s} (10. Kd2 {14s} Qxf1 {3s}
11. Kc2 {11s} Ke7 {9s} 12. Kc3 {2:16m}) (10. Kd1 {2:26m}
Kf7 {8s}) 10... Ke7 {4s} 11. Kd2 {10s} Rd8+ {11s})
5... Bxe4 {19s} 6. Kh3 {6s} (6. c5 {35s} Bxf3+ {10s}
7. Rgxf3 {14s} (7. exf3 {19s} e4 {1:02m} 8. f4 {34s} e3
{44s} 9. f5 {23s} (9. cxb6 {50s} Qd2+ {M8}) (9. Rgf3
{2:26m} e2 {M8}) (9. Kh3 {14s} e2 {M8}) 9... Qe4+ {M8})
(7. Rfxf3 {6s} Rxf3 {43s} 8. Kxf3 {5s} Kh7 {2:36m})
7... Rxf3 {41s} 8. exf3 {15s} (8. Rxf3 {38s} Qd2 {28s}
9. Kg1 {3s} Qxe2 {4s}) 8... Qd2+ {7s} 9. Kg1 {6s}) (6. a3
{7:18m} Bxf3+ {9s} 7. exf3 {2:02m} (7. Rgxf3 {11s} Rxf3
{21s} 8. exf3 {5s} (8. Rxf3 {34s} Qd2 {36s}) 8... Qd2+ {6s}
9. Kg1 {9s}) (7. Rfxf3 {25s} Rxf3 {19s}) 7... e4 {43s}
8. f4 {5s} e3 {5s}) (6. b4 {1:15m} Bxf3+ {7s} 7. Rgxf3
{15s} (7. Rfxf3 {14s} Rxf3 {12s} 8. Kxf3 {37s} Kh7 {13s})
(7. exf3 {13s} e4 {6s} 8. f4 {21s} Bxg3 {41s} 9. hxg3 {4s}
Qd2+ {4s} 10. Rf2 {11s} e3 {8s}) 7... Rxf3 {7s} 8. exf3
{1:06m} Qe3 {24s}) (6. a4 {44s} Bxf3+ {9s} 7. Rgxf3 {17s}
(7. Rfxf3 {10s} Rxf3 {31s} 8. Kxf3 {20s} Kh7 {7s}) (7. exf3
{15s} e4 {3s} 8. f4 {6s} e3 {3s} 9. f5 {14s} Qe4+ {8s})
7... Rxf3 {3s} 8. exf3 {9s} (8. Rxf3 {7s} Qd2 {11s})
8... Qd2+ {10s}) (6. Rf2 {59s} Bxf3+ {2s} 7. Rfxf3 {20s}
(7. exf3 {14s} e4 {10s} 8. f4 {12s} e3 {2s}) 7... Rxf3
{19s} 8. Kxf3 {24s} (8. Rxf3 {18s} Qd2 {12s}) 8... Kh7
{20s}) (6. Kh1 {45s} Qe3 {2:17m}) (6. g5 {2:23m} Bxf3+
{25s} 7. Rfxf3 {26s} (7. exf3 {25s} Bxg3 {31s}) 7... Rxf3
{16s} 8. Rxf3 {31s} Qd2 {9s}) (6. Rh3 {2:10m} Qe3 {15s})
6... Bxf3 {21s} 7. exf3 {20s} *
>5...Rxf3 instead 5...Bxg3+ is mate in at most 11 based on my post so I guess
>shorter mate.
I would have saved some time, when I had tried Rxf3 first. I actually come to
mate in 10.
>My guess is mate in at most 15(maybe even 14)
>I did not prove mate in 11 after 5.Kg2 but it seems to my eye that 5.Kg2 is even
>worse than 5.Ke1.
I did not try hard to make the mate short (more patience would be needed, and
there is no way with my program to really prove the shortest mate anyway - at
least not in reasonable time). After I tried Rxf3, the whole mate is now mate in
17, with 5. Kg2 given as best defense.
Regards,
Dieter
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