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Subject: Re: AMD 64 FX - PC Experts - Athlon 3400 just as good?

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 07:13:39 01/09/04

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On January 09, 2004 at 00:29:51, Tom Kerrigan wrote:

>On January 09, 2004 at 00:20:48, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On January 08, 2004 at 23:39:42, Tom Kerrigan wrote:
>>
>>>On January 08, 2004 at 22:50:32, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>>
>>>>>Where is this going on? Aren't all of the 64 bit Athlons named "Athlon 64"?
>>>>
>>>>They are not being called that everywhere.  IE 3400+ what?
>>>
>>>I think you're confused about AMD's product line. 3400+ is the speed rating.
>>>Athlon 64 is the family name. The full name of the chip is "Athlon 64 3400+" so
>>>I don't think you have a valid complaint.
>>
>>athlon.  athlon-64.  opteron.  FX51.  And there is "no confusion"?
>
>I'm not confused. Honda makes the Accord, Accord Coupe, Acura TSX, and Acura TL
>and they're all based on the Accord, yet somehow people manage...

Not all of those are "accords" with different names, however.

FX51.  athlon-64.  Opteron are the same with a minor memory controller
difference for one.

Honda does do accord dx, accord lx, accord v6, some years an accord ex or se,
but they are _all_ accords...

>
>>>>>Besides, why shouldn't 64-bit Athlons be family members with 32-bit Athlons? The
>>>>>architecture is very similar and they're backward compatible. The Athlon 64 is
>>>>>related to the Athlon more than the Pentium 4 is related to the Pentium.
>>>>
>>>>say "opteron".  that is what we are talking about.  Yet it has been called
>>>>opteron, FX51 and athlon-64.  Yes, I know that one has 1/2 the bus width,
>>>>but still, they are essentially the _same_ CPU.  I don't see the need for
>>>
>>>Yes, of course they're the same CPU, just as the Pentium 4 Xeon is the same as
>>>the Pentium 4 Mobile is the same as the Pentium 4. It's called brand
>>>differentiation.
>>
>>There are differences.  IE xeon has the cache coherency stuff for MP.  Normal
>>processors do not.  In the past, xeon has bigger L2.  It is still optional
>>in that you can buy a 2mb L2 cache xeon, but not normal PIVs.  And _everyone_
>>considers "xeon" to be "better".  Whether it is for all apps or not is another
>>issue.
>
>So? There are differences between most of the Athlon 64s and Opterons, and
>everyone considers Opterons "better" too. That's the point of AMD's branding.

The difference is that Intel doesn't just remark a xeon from a PIV.  It _is_
a different chip in some ways, and it _does_ have the same family name,
namely PIV.  AMD is not doing that.



>
>>Now we have AMD.  Opteron is king of the hill IMHO.  Yet they have "blended"
>>the name and it is getting lost in the "blend" which is unfortunate.  IE Intel
>>has made great "hay" with the xeon line.  AMD is burying the opteron name.
>
>How are they blending anything?? I don't even know what you mean by blending.

Again.  athlon-64.  FX51.  Opteron.  Same basic chip.




>
>>>It's not really nonsense. How else do you propose people tell the difference
>>>between a 486/50 and a 486DX2/50?
>>
>>I wouldn't fake the MHZ numbers, for sure.  If the external clock frequency
>>is 50mhz, it's 50mhz.  If it is 25mhz external and 50 internal, it is 25mhz.
>
>You're just digging yourself a deeper stupidity hole. If you call it a 486/25,
>how do you tell the difference between that and a 486 with a 25MHz internal
>clock? According to your backwards notion, there would be half a dozen 800MHz
>Pentium 4s that all perform differently.

I'm not digging any sort of "hole" at all.  I simply think it wrong to have
two chips that say 486-50 when they are not the same.  I think I made that
clear.  IE back to your accord.  If I buy an Accord DX, or an Accord V6, I
am getting an Accord.  Same body style, same basic parts, different engine
and performance, but then V6 says that.





>
>>>>The opteron is good enough that it doesn't _need_ to be compared to the
>>>>Intel MHZ rating...  Every time they use 3200+ they are referencing Intel,
>>>>and that seems bad for _this_ particular chip.
>>>
>>>Again, you're confused about AMD's product line. The Opteron isn't "compared to
>>>the Intel MHZ rating." Opteron chip names don't even include clock speeds.
>>>They're numbered, e.g., 240, 242, 844, etc. It's only the regular Athlon 64,
>>>intended for Average Joe's consumpion, that has these performance ratings.
>>
>>And the athlon-64 has what "core"?
>>
>>IE is it an athlon through-and-through.  Or is it an opteron in an athlon's
>>clothing?
>
>You're apparently the only person in the world who doesn't understand branding.
>
>-Tom


I suppose I must be...

And it isn't that I don't "understand" it.  I simply don't _like_ it.

There _is_ a difference, if you simply take the time to think about it.





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