Author: Omid David Tabibi
Date: 03:05:05 05/21/04
Go up one level in this thread
On May 20, 2004 at 20:03:30, Amir Ban wrote: >On May 20, 2004 at 15:10:25, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On May 20, 2004 at 11:14:49, Omid David Tabibi wrote: >> >>>On May 19, 2004 at 18:08:44, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>> >>>>On May 19, 2004 at 17:18:11, Omid David Tabibi wrote: >>>> >>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 17:07:34, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 16:02:53, Omid David Tabibi wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 15:55:04, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 14:31:41, Omid David Tabibi wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 13:29:38, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 06:14:12, Omid David Tabibi wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 06:07:45, Bryan Hofmann wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 05:33:50, Richard Pijl wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 05:05:54, Jouni Uski wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Number 1 favourite is missing, why? >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Jouni >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>Hydra is officially from the UAE. As I understood the sponsors do not allow >>>>>>>>>>>>>Hydra to participate in an event in Israel. >>>>>>>>>>>>>Richard. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>Someone please tell me that this is a rumor or missunderstanding. They banned a >>>>>>>>>>>>chess engine from participation due to the country of its creator? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Exactly the opposite. We (organizers) told the Hydra team that they are welcomed >>>>>>>>>>>to play in Israel under the UAE flag. But apparently their sponsors decided that >>>>>>>>>>>they don't want to play in Israel. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Last time an engine was banned from participation due to the country of its >>>>>>>>>>>creator was in Jakarta WMCCC 1996. The Junior team was not allowed to play there >>>>>>>>>>>because Junior is an Israeli program. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>I was under the impression that was not exactly the truth, the whold truth and >>>>>>>>>>nothing but the truth. In fact, Junior was expected there. I received a phone >>>>>>>>>>call in the wee hours of the morning from Bruce Moreland, asking me to help him >>>>>>>>>>contact Amir since they had not shown up. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>I believe this was a case of "they didn't feel welcome and chose not to attend >>>>>>>>>>for that reason." IE I can't really fault someone for not wanting to fly a UAE >>>>>>>>>>flag in the middle of Israel either. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>So, IMHO it was more a matter of they didn't participate for many good reasons, >>>>>>>>>>but I don't think they were _prevented_ from participating... >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>Based on what I have read and heard, it was made clear to them that they cannot >>>>>>>>>play under the Israeli flag in Jakarta. In other words, they were prevented from >>>>>>>>>participation. Of course Amir or Shay can correct me if I'm wrong. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Probably was (a) a sane decision to not fly an Israeli flag there and (b) a >>>>>>>>reasonable decision for them not to attend if they could not. As I said, a bit >>>>>>>>of both... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>I quoted Shay Bushinsky in the following post: >>>>>>>http://talkchess.com/forums/1/message.html?366082 >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Based on that, it was not a decision on behalf of the Junior team not to attend, >>>>>>>they were simply *banned* from participation. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>reread what you posted. They were not "banned". >>>>>> >>>>>>Unless you redefine banned to mean something other than "not allowed". As I >>>>>>said, they could have participated, not representing Israel. >>>>> >>>>>"not representing Israel", in other words *banned* from playing as Israeli >>>>>representatives. What's hard to understand about that? >>>> >>>>Are you really that dense, or just acting so to prolong a discussion? >>>> >>>>"banned" means "not allowed to participate, _period_. It does not mean "not >>>>allowed to participate under flag XXX or anything else". It means "not allowed >>>>to participate." >>>> >>>>What is so hard to understand about using _proper_ definitions and terms? >>>> >>>>Yes they were _hindered_ from participating. Or they were even discouraged from >>>>participating. But they were not _banned_ from participating... >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>>The Hydra team was explicitly told that they are welcome to play under the UAE >>>>>flag. >>>>> >>>>>P.S. Of course I'm not criticizing the Hydra team, as they wanted to join. The >>>>>guys who prevented that were their UAE sponsors. >>>> >>>>Both decisions to not play are reasonable... >>> >>>And by the way, why is Hydra's political decision not to play in Israel >>>"reasonable"? >>> >>> >>> >> >>If I were asked to participate in a tournament in any Arab nation, do you >>_really_ think I would do so and fly the stars and bars over my monitor? And >>invite every radical in the world to drop by and leave a "gift"... >> >>I can see their point. >> >>There is a major Arab/Israeli conflict going on. I would be no more inclined to >>wave a UAE flag in Israel than I would waving an Israeli flag on the Gaza >>strip... >> > >An Arab flag in Israel would produce no animosity. Additionally, Hydra team is consisted of three people from Austria, Germany, and Turkey, and I know for sure that they wanted to participated, and only the veto from UAE stopped them from doing so. So, the political decision of their UAE sponsors was far from "reasonable". > >Amir > > >>might as well wear a t-shirt with a bullseye painted on the back, and a big sign >>that says "shoot this way"... >> >>Areas involved in conflict could give _anyone_ second thoughts... >> >> >>> >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>>I don't like that >>>>>>option and as I also said, I considered their not showing up as "a reasonable >>>>>>decision". >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>I don't want >>>>>>>>>>>>to lead the discussion into a political debate here but if the above statement >>>>>>>>>>>>is true, this bigotry should not be condoned and further posting of this event >>>>>>>>>>>>should not be allowed here.
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