Author: Amir Ban
Date: 17:03:30 05/20/04
Go up one level in this thread
On May 20, 2004 at 15:10:25, Robert Hyatt wrote: >On May 20, 2004 at 11:14:49, Omid David Tabibi wrote: > >>On May 19, 2004 at 18:08:44, Robert Hyatt wrote: >> >>>On May 19, 2004 at 17:18:11, Omid David Tabibi wrote: >>> >>>>On May 19, 2004 at 17:07:34, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>> >>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 16:02:53, Omid David Tabibi wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 15:55:04, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 14:31:41, Omid David Tabibi wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 13:29:38, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 06:14:12, Omid David Tabibi wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 06:07:45, Bryan Hofmann wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 05:33:50, Richard Pijl wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2004 at 05:05:54, Jouni Uski wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>Number 1 favourite is missing, why? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>Jouni >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>Hydra is officially from the UAE. As I understood the sponsors do not allow >>>>>>>>>>>>Hydra to participate in an event in Israel. >>>>>>>>>>>>Richard. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Someone please tell me that this is a rumor or missunderstanding. They banned a >>>>>>>>>>>chess engine from participation due to the country of its creator? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>Exactly the opposite. We (organizers) told the Hydra team that they are welcomed >>>>>>>>>>to play in Israel under the UAE flag. But apparently their sponsors decided that >>>>>>>>>>they don't want to play in Israel. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>Last time an engine was banned from participation due to the country of its >>>>>>>>>>creator was in Jakarta WMCCC 1996. The Junior team was not allowed to play there >>>>>>>>>>because Junior is an Israeli program. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>I was under the impression that was not exactly the truth, the whold truth and >>>>>>>>>nothing but the truth. In fact, Junior was expected there. I received a phone >>>>>>>>>call in the wee hours of the morning from Bruce Moreland, asking me to help him >>>>>>>>>contact Amir since they had not shown up. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>I believe this was a case of "they didn't feel welcome and chose not to attend >>>>>>>>>for that reason." IE I can't really fault someone for not wanting to fly a UAE >>>>>>>>>flag in the middle of Israel either. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>So, IMHO it was more a matter of they didn't participate for many good reasons, >>>>>>>>>but I don't think they were _prevented_ from participating... >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>Based on what I have read and heard, it was made clear to them that they cannot >>>>>>>>play under the Israeli flag in Jakarta. In other words, they were prevented from >>>>>>>>participation. Of course Amir or Shay can correct me if I'm wrong. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Probably was (a) a sane decision to not fly an Israeli flag there and (b) a >>>>>>>reasonable decision for them not to attend if they could not. As I said, a bit >>>>>>>of both... >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>I quoted Shay Bushinsky in the following post: >>>>>>http://talkchess.com/forums/1/message.html?366082 >>>>>> >>>>>>Based on that, it was not a decision on behalf of the Junior team not to attend, >>>>>>they were simply *banned* from participation. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>reread what you posted. They were not "banned". >>>>> >>>>>Unless you redefine banned to mean something other than "not allowed". As I >>>>>said, they could have participated, not representing Israel. >>>> >>>>"not representing Israel", in other words *banned* from playing as Israeli >>>>representatives. What's hard to understand about that? >>> >>>Are you really that dense, or just acting so to prolong a discussion? >>> >>>"banned" means "not allowed to participate, _period_. It does not mean "not >>>allowed to participate under flag XXX or anything else". It means "not allowed >>>to participate." >>> >>>What is so hard to understand about using _proper_ definitions and terms? >>> >>>Yes they were _hindered_ from participating. Or they were even discouraged from >>>participating. But they were not _banned_ from participating... >>> >>> >>>> >>>>The Hydra team was explicitly told that they are welcome to play under the UAE >>>>flag. >>>> >>>>P.S. Of course I'm not criticizing the Hydra team, as they wanted to join. The >>>>guys who prevented that were their UAE sponsors. >>> >>>Both decisions to not play are reasonable... >> >>And by the way, why is Hydra's political decision not to play in Israel >>"reasonable"? >> >> >> > >If I were asked to participate in a tournament in any Arab nation, do you >_really_ think I would do so and fly the stars and bars over my monitor? And >invite every radical in the world to drop by and leave a "gift"... > >I can see their point. > >There is a major Arab/Israeli conflict going on. I would be no more inclined to >wave a UAE flag in Israel than I would waving an Israeli flag on the Gaza >strip... > An Arab flag in Israel would produce no animosity. Amir >might as well wear a t-shirt with a bullseye painted on the back, and a big sign >that says "shoot this way"... > >Areas involved in conflict could give _anyone_ second thoughts... > > >> >> >> >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>>>I don't like that >>>>>option and as I also said, I considered their not showing up as "a reasonable >>>>>decision". >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>I don't want >>>>>>>>>>>to lead the discussion into a political debate here but if the above statement >>>>>>>>>>>is true, this bigotry should not be condoned and further posting of this event >>>>>>>>>>>should not be allowed here.
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