Author: Mike Welling
Date: 11:55:25 01/14/99
Go up one level in this thread
On January 13, 1999 at 21:54:29, Matthew Herman wrote: >On January 13, 1999 at 10:55:07, Mike Welling wrote: > >>On January 10, 1999 at 11:22:15, Matthew Herman wrote: >> >>>Yep I downloaded it, and also have deleted it from my HD.. it has tons of >>>general protection faults, its ics interface BITES, it is NOT the most powerful >>>db etc.. it has lots of problems and I don't consider it even NEAR Cb7 or Ca4.. >>>Lots of hype .. but nothin to support it.. (I think it allows cheating on >>>unrated games.. what a waste.. the last thing an ICS needs is to have people >>>able to cheat without even opening up a seperate program!!) >> >>Being very amazed about your message I couldn't resist to reply. >>I've also downloaded Chessvision a while ago and in my opinion its a great >>package. I've looked pretty much into it and didn't experience any general. >>protection fault yet. Also,I do not have any display-problems, however, I read >>in the newsgroup 'rec.games.chess.computer that there are problems with it when >you have in your videosettings large fonts selected. >> >For me, the interface of Chessvision is far more advanced and user-friendly then >cb7. For example you can create your own desktops with multiple boards, multiple >databaseviews, multiple engines etc.. and save them as sessions. Further, it has >more position-tree facilities and nearly unlimited search capabilities. It keeps >track of all the installed databases the way it should, and maintains one >central player-database with nice options like automatically rating-assignment >to unrated games and replace misspelled players by the correct ones globally. >> >>But Chessvision is even more than a database-package. As you noticed it also has >an interface for Internet Chess servers. I figured it out myself but Chessvision >absolutely doesn't allow you to use an engine while playing games at these >servers. You can only use them while watching games of others. Due to the >realtime engine-analyis and position-tree information, Chessvision gives me much >more pleasure to watch the Hoogovens games at ICC then with their own interface. >> >>Ofcourse you need an open mind to accept a new package competing with the >>'standard'. You probably spend a lot of money and time in something like cb7 and >do not want to accept anything new which might be better. For those who think >I'm overreacting, just download Chessvision at http://www.microvision.nl and >look for yourself. >> >>Mike Welling > >Let me reply .. the part about cheating on ICS servers .. that was before I (or >I think most anyone) knew it wasnt allowed in unrated games with chessvision. >Secondly the database functions of CB7 and/or ca4 ARE more powerful. The engines >interface (as reported by KomputerKorner) only allow the crafties that come with >it (not any new or other engines, which is disappointing). Ca4 and Cb7 both give >position-tree information and realtime engine analysis (position tree is nothing >new). Most of what you mentioned is already in cb7/ca4 and is done better (also >i don't have large fonts selected and I got the gp faults). Though who really is >going to spend $300 for ChessVision "mega" when you can get CB7 with a 1.1 >million game db, 3 issues of CBM for about 50-70$ less.. not to mention CA4 also >being alot cheaper.. This piece of software may be useful, but there needs to be >a few "fixes", and something a little more innovative before I am going to plunk >down 100-300$.. this argument about not wanting to accept something newer >because I spend alot of time in cb7 is alot weaker than the Cm6k issue (where >cm6k does have a very powerful engine and should compete with the others). Cb7 >is the most widely used database program at the top level.. Ca4 is also very >widely used.. ChessVision hasn't really brought anything new to the market.. and >ics interface is something that isn't that hard to put in and that really is the >only "new thing" I could find.. and it is even found in chesspartner4.0026. > >I am not trying to put down this software.. just shed some light on its claims >that it is the "next greatest thing" (or something like that claim was made on >the website).. > >How also is ChessVision "more advanced, and more user-friendly"? >Please explain what you are stating .. On their homepage there is a link (http://www.microvision.nl/cv_engine_program.htm)to a page for engine- programmers that explains how to make an engine ready for Chessvision. So I think its only up to the engine-programmmers if they want to spend a few weeks or so to create an engine-module that can be loaded into Chessvision. Your mention about position-trees, indeed, they are not new, but the one provided in Cb7 doesn't appeal to me that much. I do not like to have all rating-levels mixed up in one big position-tree. Despite the average rating, I never know the value of its percentages. I want to have more databases and position-trees divided into separate rating-levels and I do not want to struggle with them switching from one to another. Chessvision lets you create more position-trees on your desktop each attached to its own selection of databases and if I directly want to examine all the games with a certain position I only have to drag it from the tree to the desktop and all the games popup immediately no matter how many databases are involved. The way Chessvison handles multiple databases, multiple position trees, the link between those and how they all can be effective on your desktop is pretty much innovative to me. (By the way, the trees show the difference between the #games 'playing the move' and #games 'with the resulting position' which is very useful). Also the user-interface is great. I created a desktop with a lot of databaseviews active, serveral boards next to eachother with different games analyzed by different engines at the same time and I can save this hole thing in a session. Just reload the session and really the hole interface with everything running including the last detail is fully restored. I can't say other than this is user-friendly. About the price, indeed its not cheap, but personally I mostly want to buy something because it does things I like and not because its just cheap. Don't get me wrong. Cb offers a great package and certainly has deserved its leadership in the market, its just that I found in Chessvision a bunch of things I like more. Mike Welling
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