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Subject: Re: Unfriendly computer blitz

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 17:11:03 12/07/99

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On December 07, 1999 at 18:55:59, Chuck wrote:

>On December 07, 1999 at 16:54:15, Ricardo Gibert wrote:
>
>>On December 07, 1999 at 14:22:19, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>>
>>>On December 07, 1999 at 00:01:08, Ricardo Gibert wrote:
>>>
>>>>On ICC, I often see computers winning games against strong players by
>>>>"unfriendly" means. Consider what happens when the position is dead drawn, >>>but the computer player does not realize this and makes an unending series of
>>>>aimless moves that drains the human opponent of time on his clock. It isn't >>>any secret that computers have "faster reflexes". This is boring and inflates >>>the apparent strength of the program.
>>>>
>>>>I propose that computer programs should offer/accept draws when the following
>>>>conditions hold:
>>>>
>>>>1) There have been no pawn moves or captures played by
>>>>   either side over the past 10 ply played. Of course
>>>>   the 50 move rule counter is perfect for this.
>>>
>>>This is total nonsense.  I have seen _many_ games where no pawn move or
>>>capture was played over a 5 move (10 ply) stretch.  This has _nothing_ to
>>>do with the game called "chess".
>>
>>Please explain why you consider this to be total nonsense. It is clear that >this >is reliable indicator of whether substantive change has taken place on >the >chessboard.
>
>I'm afraid I have to agree with Ricardo on this issue. It is certainly true that
>alot of drawn games are won "inappropriately" by computers. Think for a moment
>of such a game (we've all seen them) and how you'd react if you were the human
>and some other human were on the other side of the board being so stupid. If it
>were I, I'd be upset. I'm sure we'd have words. I don't think it's enough to
>give computers the excuse that they can't recognize the draw. Our goal should be
>to make them recognize the draw first. And actually, in real tournaments these
>days you CAN do something about, you can claim your opponent has insufficient
>winning chances. This should be implemented in programs, in some way, and it may
>vary considering the program and it's eval. But it should be done, 1st because
>it's not really fair or right, but even moreso, because it's really poor
>etiquette.
>
>And as far as the game of chess goes, when I start a game, I expect both myself
>and my opponent to obey certain rules of etiquette.


And this includes your opponent looking over at the clock and saying "Hmmm...  I
have 4 minutes left, my opponent has 15 seconds left, I suppose I ought to offer
him a draw..."

That's never happened in any fast game _I_ have ever played, on a server or at
a club...

You get that far behind, you lose...



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