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Subject: Re: Shredder is World Champion, the rest is details

Author: Ed Schröder

Date: 09:42:07 01/26/00

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On January 26, 2000 at 08:57:43, Enrique Irazoqui wrote:

>On January 26, 2000 at 08:48:03, Ed Schröder wrote:
>
>>On January 26, 2000 at 08:26:42, Enrique Irazoqui wrote:
>>
>>>On January 26, 2000 at 07:45:02, Ed Schröder wrote:
>>>
>>>>On January 26, 2000 at 07:17:05, Enrique Irazoqui wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>About being "World champion, the rest is details", it's a classic case of
>>>>>hypostatization, which is "to attribute real identity to a concept."
>>>>>
>>>>>1. We create a Swiss tournament of 11 rounds and name it World Championship.
>>>>>2. Program X wins the tournament and becomes World Champion.
>>>>>3. We are to believe that program X is the best because it is the World Champion
>>>>>and the rest is details.
>>>>>
>>>>>If this 11 round tournament would have given another name, for instance ICCA
>>>>>championship, steps 2 and 3 wouldn't cross anybody's mind.
>>>>>
>>>>>With this I don't intend to attack Shredder 4, Junior 4.6 or Fritz 3, all fine
>>>>>programs and none of them the best, but to question the meaning of a name.
>>>>>
>>>>>No human would become world champion after playing a total of 11 games in his
>>>>>life, and I don't think programs should either.
>>>>>
>>>>>Enrique
>>>>
>>>>Would you knock off the Champions League? It's the same system and generally
>>>>accepted. The one who wins is the strongest.
>>>
>>>Therefore Junior 4.6 was the strongest, and you know it wasn't.
>>>
>>>You can't compare chess and football, for the same reason that you can't compare
>>>apples and oranges. But if you want to stick to your analogy, imagine a
>>>Champions League consisting of 5 minute games.
>>>
>>>Imagine also that FIDE organizes a World Championship in the form of a Swiss
>>>tournament of 11 rounds. Whould you consider the winner as World Champion? The
>>>Las Vegas thing crowned Khalifman as World Champion. Who believes in it?
>>>Kasparov is World Champion after winning many matches of all sort and an
>>>extraordinary career. We all believe he is the World Champion.
>>>
>>>Enrique
>>
>>That was not my point. When Barcelona wins the Champions League or Holland
>>becomes world champion does that mean they are the strongest?
>
>If the Barcelona wins, yes. :)
>
>Still apples and oranges...

No.

Under the Paderborn conditions Shredder was the strongest and became
world champion. Manual games, book preparation, some luck. Auto232 is
about others conditions: long matches, book learning etc.

IMO a WCC is something else than SSDF. Both have their values and often
both show different winners.

Ed


>Enrique
>
>>Ed



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