Computer Chess Club Archives




Subject: Re: WMCCC

Author: Thorsten Czub

Date: 14:40:35 10/05/97

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>The program was announced to be available in March/April 1997, but

I guess it was announced earlier. When I remember it accurate it was
announced in different degrees. One announcement I have in mind was

But --- I am not the right person to critic this.
CSTal was announced years ago :-)))))))

>was delayed due to problems (e.g. copyright, - visit our homepage for
>till two weeks ago ! Now, we have given sale and service to a german

I hope anything will work now.
Your program could be a nice effort and approach cause it uses NEW WAY's
to deal with chess. Thats exactly what we need. New ideas and approaches
of AI.

>> But this is data Gambit can write books about...
>>  It is well known to any german gambit-soft customers cause Berthold
>> Seifriz from Gambit soft opened his correspondance with Borgstaedt and
>> put it on the server.

Berthold was in very very bad mood when I asked him about...
Of course the situation was not easy for any side.

>Yes, and some of the published correspondence was not written by me!
>It seems to me that Gambit-Soft started a "campaign" against Goliath,
>because he was perhaps angry about the delay.
>Now my lawyer is checking the situation and I think that we will go to
>court to finish this "shit".
>> The customers felt betrayed cause they have ordered and paid for a
>> program that was not existing ! Anybody was angry.
>I have got not more than 10 direct orders with advance payment. Not all
>was refunded, cause some customers confirmed to wait for the program.
>If you have informations about paying to delears, please contact
>me (private email please).

Nono. All i know is that people paid in forward although there was no
That is exactly what you say now yourself.
It is right that we chess-people are THAT crazy that we WANT something
although it seems to be a ghost...

I understand this behaviour. I am the same kind of addict.
We want the impossible. And sometimes the impossible happens. But often

>In March 1997 more than 12 german companies were advertising Goliath.
>To most of them, we haven't had any contact up to that time. Only two of
>the companies had ordered the program.

:-) As I said: people need myths and dreams to get energy and hope.
The people wanted your program to be strong and existant.

>Look at "Schachversand West" company for example: Never contacted, no
>from us, no informations, no permission to advertise Goliath. But they
>are offering the program at dumping-level.

!!!! :-)

You and I know that german law forbids to announce a product you cannot
If you announce something that you don't have to sell, it is against the
german law. Of course Schachversand West seems to be a distributor
selling anything cheaper :-)))

>I'm wondering what's going on.

Crime !!

>> Goliath exists. I have a copy. It looks like Turbochess from the screen
>> and is a text-engine. I had email-correspondance with Borgstaedt.
>> But I was impossible to find out about this program in general. There
>> is something strange with the program or the persons behind.
>> The program plays weak, and i cannot believe that anybody would buy
>> this text-engine...
>No!! You have a copy of the beta-engine, not more. This was a
>reg. the new selective search technique and includes only minimized
>knowledge. Please check the correspondance and readme-file before
>publishing negative informations.

It was the latest engine at this time, or ?
Or the latest you were able to send.
Come on Mr.Borgstaedt. We are under us.
This is not rgcc.

>Of course, Goliath comes with an up-to-date Windows-Interface !

!!! Nice. No mouse and text-engine is not easy to handle...

>Seems it is time to release a demo-version. I'm very busy (WMCCC),
>but will place screenshots and demos on our homepages next week!
>Check it!

OK. When I remember it right the problem was you had to build the
graphics interface twice because one partner went off in between the
development. This is very sad of course. You are shortly before
releasing and then suddenly one partner destroys anything. I feel for

>Yes ! There was something strange with the persons behind!
>But these persons don't belong any longer to the Goliath-team, cause
>they were the reason for many problems and 7 months delay.

It was even so strange that I sometimes had the feeling you used this
NOT KNOWN GUY as an alibi. I was not totally sure about this fact. But
had the suspicion.

>Now, only Mr. Fischer and I are programming Goliath, supported by
>a strong International masters (opening book).
>Best regards,
>M. Borgstaedt

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