Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 15:36:35 11/09/00
Go up one level in this thread
On November 09, 2000 at 15:40:28, Wieland Belka wrote: >On November 08, 2000 at 22:09:58, Robert Hyatt wrote: > >>On November 08, 2000 at 16:25:43, Wieland Belka wrote: >> >>>On November 07, 2000 at 17:36:35, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>> >>>>On November 07, 2000 at 17:01:16, Wieland Belka wrote: >>>> >>>>>On November 07, 2000 at 10:30:06, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>>> >>>>>>On November 07, 2000 at 06:56:01, Wieland Belka wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>>On November 05, 2000 at 09:42:40, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>>On November 05, 2000 at 06:09:28, Wieland Belka wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>On November 04, 2000 at 23:58:39, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>On November 04, 2000 at 12:59:23, Wieland Belka wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Posted by Robert Hyatt on November 03, 2000 at 20:53:12: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>In Reply to: Re: Crafty 17.13 - using game archives by engines? posted by >>>>>>>>>>>Wieland Belka on November 03, 2000 at 18:19:53: >>>>>>>>>>>On November 03, 2000 at 18:19:53, Wieland Belka wrote: >On November 02, 2000 at >>>>>>>>>>>14:25:48, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>On November 02, 2000 at 13:22:08, Wieland Belka wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hello Crafty friends, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>using opening books it's a great part of Crafty's strong playing, well. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>1. How could I complete Crafty's book with specific opening stuff? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>2. Can Crafty profit from any game archives? If yes, on which way? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Can anybody help? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Thanks Wieland >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>This is not hard to do... you can use _any_ collection of PGN games >>>>>>>>>>>>>>you want, in order to build an opening book that covers the specific >>>>>>>>>>>>>>openings you want to play against. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>We already have 2M game collections available. My ftp machine is full >>>>>>>>>>>>>>of pgn files... The problem is "quality". not "quantity". The pgn has >>>>>>>>>>>>>>typos, games by patzers, horrible blunders, openings that have been busted, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>and so forth. Learning will help, but it definitely takes time. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>Bob, thanks for reply! >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>You are right, of course, because of the quality of collections of PGN games. >>>>>>>>>>>>>But I meant: If I had a little, but good collection to a specific rare opening, >>>>>>>>>>>>>on which way could I *complete* Crafty's original book? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>The way to do this is to take the original PGN, and then _add_ to it with the stuff you want to >use. In fact, the books.bin file is made to add to in this fashion, leaving book.bin to be a >large "backup" for when books.bin is >>>>>>>>>>>>no longer useful. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>What do you mean with _add_? A command? Unknown by your command list v. 17.XX! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>There is no "add command". You have to have the original PGN file used to >>>>>>>>>>create the book, then to this file you "add" the new pgn you want included. >>>>>>>>>>You do this with any editor of your choice. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>And my second ask: Is it the right way to produce own openings books with *your* >>>>>>>>>>>>>collections of PGN games on your ftp server? The way for that is clear, but is >>>>>>>>>>>>>it well? Or is your Crafty opening book already the best solution? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>regards Wieland >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>What I do now is _not_ optimal. It needs a lot more work, which will happen >>>>>>>>>>>>over the next year or two. I don't believe in hand-crafted books, as they >>>>>>>>>>>>require too much human labor. But they are difficult to beat, without a _lot_ >>>>>>>>>>>>of work... >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>Bob, I'm a new fan of your Crafty! But the only thing I have is your command >>>>>>>>>>>list v. 17.XX!! >>>>>>>>>>>What are you telling me?! Is it possible to complete your opening book >>>>>>>>>>>"book.bin" with own serious PGN game collections? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>regards Wieland >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>yes. building the book simply sucks in a big pgn file. You can put _anything_ >>>>>>>>>>into that file that you think is appropriate. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>Bob, please, sorry, but we are turning in a cycle again! ;-) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>I only wanted to say: The way to create an own opening book is clear. But I >>>>>>>>>asked after a solution (Crafty commands!) to *complete* Crafty's book! Your >>>>>>>>>command list v. 17.XX is not telling about it! >>>>>>>>>By the way: I do not know exactly meaning of "book.bin" here and "books.bin" on >>>>>>>>>the other side. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>There is no command to "complete" crafty's book. You can only create a >>>>>>>>book from raw PGN. Not add to it. Before you create the book, you can >>>>>>>>put _anything_ in the pgn file. Then after you create the book from this >>>>>>>>pgn file, you will have a book with the moves you want included. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>Okay, now I understood. I can not complete your existing Crafty's opening books >>>>>>>directly. >>>>>>>And the other way: Is it possible to create a PGN file from your "book.bin" to >>>>>>>complete with my stuff and create a new Crafty book.bin? >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>No. the hashing is non-reversible. But the original PGN file is already >>>>>>available on my ftp machine (enormous.pgn is the file you want, it is broken >>>>>>into pieces to make it easier to download). >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>Thanks, Bob! Now I'm knowing really more than before! The last ones: >>>>>1. What parameter do you recommend creating a really good new book.bin for >>>>>Crafty? >>>>> And books.bin?? >>>> >>>>I don't believe that (at present) it is possible to create a "really good book" >>>>from pgn game collections. There are too many mistakes, blunders, refuted >>>>moves, and so forth. >>>> >>>>This is a tough problem to do automatically. >>>> >>> >>>But you have done so, too?! >>> >>>>>2. Is your "enormous.pgn" better than Dann Corbit's PGN opening folders under >>>>> ftp://cap.connx.com/pub/a-openings/ and following? >>> >>>>No idea. Dan knows what I have. I believe what I have came from what he >>>>has, which means if you combine all his stuff you get the file I use. >>> >>> >>>And you do not know that?? Who did deliver "enormous.pgn"? I only ask to know >>>which chances I have to create own opening books ... >> >> >>I believe Dann put all of that together... > > >Bob, English is not my native language. If you answering too short, I can not >understand sure. >What did you mean with that? I only want to see if your "enormous.pgn" was >produced >from Dann Corbit's game (opening) collection! Yes. Although Dann can provide more details. IE he may now have even more PGN data that is _not_ part of enormous.pgn.
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