Author: Uri Blass
Date: 16:27:46 09/12/01
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On September 12, 2001 at 18:43:39, Dann Corbit wrote: >On September 12, 2001 at 17:57:42, Uri Blass wrote: > >>On September 12, 2001 at 17:04:13, Dann Corbit wrote: >> >>>On September 12, 2001 at 16:07:45, Uri Blass wrote: >>>[snip] >>>>I think that your program understands the position better than >>>>Deeper blue. >>>> >>>>It is more logical to assume that Deeper blue is wrong and not that >>>>all the top programs are wrong. >>> >>>Try all the top programs on this one: >>>2b5/1r6/2kBp1p1/p2pP1P1/2pP4/1pP3K1/1R3P2/8 b - - bm Rb4; id "WAC.230"; >>> >>>6 billion votes "AYE!" >>>1 vote "NAY." >>> >>>The one vote may be right, and the 6 billion wrong. >>>[snippity-snip] >> >>I remember that there was a discussion about this position and it was not clear >>if Rb4 wins. > >It is unclear. It is the only move with winning chances, but it is possible it >is only a draw. There are other test problems as well that no chess engine can >answer correctly. > >>I do not say that the majority is always right but I tend to believe the >>majority if I have no evidence that it is wrong and in the case of the draw >>against kasparov in game 2 I tend to believe that programs see 0.00 some plies >>after the root for the right reason. > >It is certainly possible that modern chess programs might do better in some >positions. Certainly not on all of them, especially those plagued by null move. > >>program of today also can find Qe3 when programs like Genius3 could not do it >>so I tend to believe that deeper blue's evaluation is similiar to some old >>programs that cannot find Qe3 and not to the new programs. > >That is an interesting theory. > >>I also tend to believe that the new programs are better than the old programs >>and the fact that they can find Qe3 (even without 0.00 evaluation) when old >>programs like Genius3 or Deeper blue cannot do it is not luck. > >Genius 3 and Deep Blue are not comparable, in my opinion. We know that there >were 4000 tunable parameters in the eval. Does *any* modern program have this? I have no evidence for it except stories. I could see nothing impressive in the moves of the games that suggest that deeper blue was better than the top programs of today. My analysis suggests that their evaluation was slightly inferior than the top programs of today. Based on analysis of positions their speed in tactics seems to be similiar to Deep Fritz on good hardware(2-3 times faster than my PIII800). Uri
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