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Subject: Re: DEEP BLUES AVERAGE PLY?

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 11:12:05 08/22/02

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On August 22, 2002 at 11:34:53, Gian-Carlo Pascutto wrote:

>On August 22, 2002 at 11:07:57, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>I'm not handwaving at all.  Why don't you take crafty on a 1 processor box
>>and then compute its branching factor.  Then do the same on a 4 processor
>>box using only the time required to search.  The numbers will track quite
>>well.  In fact, you can _not_ use the parallel nodes searched to compute
>>a real branching factor for obvious reasons...
>
>Crafty != DT. Moreover, later in this post you say that it's an
>apples to oranges comparison. Again I'm missing some consistency here.
>
>>As I have also said, until you understand their parallel search in particular,
>>don't let a few months of fiddling with a primitive parallel search algorithm
>>color your thinking.  More processors in their case (more hardware processors
>>not more software processors) does _not_ give them trouble "kicking them in."
>>
>>Their search doesn't work like yours.  Not anything related, in fact...
>>
>>>
>>>I still haven't seen this sufficiently addressed, so I will get some more
>>>data about it myself.
>>
>>Read his thesis.  Then you will understand why you are comparing apples to
>>oranges when you compare a software search like you are doing to what they
>>are (were) doing...
>>
>>The problems and issues are completely different...
>
>Whether I have read their thesis is completely irrelevant to the very basic
>fact that you cannot calculate a branching factor when you're looking at
>*times* in a situation where the *nodes per second* is variable.
>
>The traditional idea of a branching factor becomes meaningless in this
>situation, so quoting 4.0 as theirs is just as meaningless.


It is better than a wild guess.  And I can certainly prove that for my
program, at reasonable search depths, the number of processors is not an
issue that affects the branching factor...

Nodes is a red-herring because the more processors you use, the more nodes
you search in total as well.  But who cares?  What I care about is that if I
am going to do a depth N+1 search, how long is it going to take me, compared to
the depth N search I just finished.  And _that_ is the classic definition of
"effective branching factor".  "real branching factor" is probably meaningless
in a parallel search because it doesn't tell you anything at all that is useful.
But the time multiplier for the next iteration _is_ useful and important.  ANd
that is _exactly_ what I calculated from the logs.  And so long as their logs
say that a 12 ply software search requires 3.9X longer than a 11 ply software
search, I would call _that_ effective branching factor to be 3.9...  any way
you care to measure it.



>
>--
>GCP



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