Author: Odd Gunnar Malin
Date: 11:18:44 01/23/03
Go up one level in this thread
On January 23, 2003 at 13:10:01, Uri Blass wrote: >On January 23, 2003 at 12:56:01, K. Burcham wrote: > >> >> >> [D] 2k4r/1pp2ppp/p1p1bn2/4N3/1q1rP3/2N1Q3/PPP2PPP/R4RK1 w - - 0 1 >> >>Deep Shredder 7 >> >> 8/23 0:01 +0.84++ 14.Nd5 Qa4 15.Nxf6 Qxc2 16.Qxd4 Qxf2+ 17.Rxf2 (581.238) >>539.1 >> 8/23 0:01 +0.93 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.cxd4 Nxe4 17.Rab1 Qxa2 18.Rfc1 >>(738.043) 549.1 >> 9/20 0:01 +0.94 14.Nd5 Bxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.cxd4 Bxe4 17.Nxf7 Re8 18.Ne5 Kb8 >>(1.094.627) 560.4 >> 10/25 0:02 +1.19++ 14.Nd5 Bxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Nxe4 17.Qa7 Bxa2 18.Rad1 >>Qxc3 (1.669.623) 562.3 >> 10/25 0:03 +1.31 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.c4 Nc3 (2.017.320) 576.3 >> 11/24 0:05 +1.17 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.c4 Nc3 20.Rfe1 Rd8 (3.322.082) 584.0 >> 12/32 0:12 +1.23 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.Rfe1 Rd8 20.c4 Nb4 21.a3 (7.400.745) 598.0 >> 13/32 0:27 +1.29 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.Rfe1 f6 20.Nc4 b5 21.Rxe6 bxc4 (16.428.560) 588.7 >> 14/34 0:56 +1.29 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.Rfe1 Rd8 (32.534.857) 578.0 >> 15/35 2:08 +1.12 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.Rfe1 f6 20.Nc4 b5 21.Nb6+ Nxb6 22.Rxe6 Nc4 (73.386.716) 570.7 >> 16/42 5:04 +1.21 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.Rfe1 f6 20.Nd3 Re8 21.Rac1 Kd7 22.c4 Nc7 23.f3 (171.076.885) 562.6 >> 17/42 11:02 +1.05 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.Rfe1 Rd8 20.Rad1 b5 21.c4 (368.094.871) 555.9 >> 18/45 28:29 +1.14 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.Rfe1 b5 20.Rac1 Nb6 21.Rc2 Rd8 22.Nf3 Bd5 23.Nd4 a5 (938.327.084) 548.9 >> 19/51 64:11 +1.09 14.Nd5 cxd5 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxd4 Qb6 17.Qxb6 cxb6 18.exd5 >>Nxd5 19.Rfe1 Rd8 20.a4 f6 21.Nd3 Rd6 22.Nb4 (2.087.116.335) 541.8 >>best move: Nc3-d5 time: 66:20.750 min n/s: 541.737 CPU 199.7% nodes: >>2.156.519.795 >> >> >>Deep Fritz 7: >> >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.cxd4 dxe4 4.Rfb1 Qc2 >> ± (0.72) Depth: 7/21 00:00:00 331kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.cxd4 dxe4 4.Rfb1 Qc2 >> ± (0.72) Depth: 8/21 00:00:00 663kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.c4 >> ± (0.84) Depth: 9/25 00:00:00 1040kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.c4 Nc3 7.Rfe1 >> ± (0.81) Depth: 10/23 00:00:01 2448kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.c4 Nc3 7.Rfe1 >> ± (0.81) Depth: 11/24 00:00:04 7495kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.Rfe1 Rd8 7.Rac1 b5 >>8.c4 >> ² (0.69) Depth: 12/29 00:00:10 16436kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.Rfe1 Rd8 7.Rac1 Nf4 >>8.c4 >> ± (0.72) Depth: 13/32 00:00:30 48792kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.Rfe1 Rd8 7.a4 f6 8.Nc4 >>Kd7 >> ² (0.66) Depth: 14/36 00:01:12 115903kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.Rfe1 b5 7.Rac1 f6 >> ² (0.56) Depth: 15/39 00:03:28 334758kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.Rfe1 b5 7.Rac1 Nc7 >>8.a3 >> ² (0.56) Depth: 16/40 00:09:44 930188kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.Rfe1 Rd8 7.Rad1 b5 >>8.a3 f6 >> ² (0.53) Depth: 17/42 00:20:35 1983548kN >>1.Nd5 cxd5 2.c3 Qxb2 3.Qxd4 Qb6 4.Qxb6 cxb6 5.exd5 Nxd5 6.Rfe1 Rd8 7.a4 Nf4 >>8.Rab1 >> ² (0.63) Depth: 18/49 01:03:57 6138332kN >> >> >>[Site "Triberg"] >>[Date "1934"] >>[White "Bogoljubov, E"] >>[Black "Muller"] >>[Result "1-0"] >>[ECO "C68"] >> >>1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bb5 a6 4. Bxc6 dxc6 5. Nc3 >>Bc5 6. d3 Qe7 7. Be3 Nf6 8. Bxc5 Qxc5 9. Qd2 >>Bg4 10. d4 Qb4 11. Nxe5 O-O-O 12. O-O Rxd4 13. Qe3 >>Be6 14. Nd5 Qc5 15. Qxd4 Qxd4 16. Ne7+ Kb8 17. N7xc6+ >>bxc6 18. Nxc6+ 1-0 >> >>kburcham > >Thanks for the analysis but the question is if white can win > >It is clear that black in the game did not choose the best defence. >The right move is simply to capture the knight. > >+0.6 or even +1 is not a convincing score to prove that white can win and I am >still not sure about it. > >Uri I guess the lines which probably got it into the book are: 14.Nd5! cxd 15.c3 Qxb2 16.Qxb4 dxe? 17.Ra7 (threat Qa8#) Nd7 18.Rfb1 and winning the queen. 14.Nd5! Qc5 15.Ne7+ Kb8 16.Nxc6+ bxc 17.Nxc6+ and winning the queen. A move like 14.Rd1 is 'a hope the opponent blunder' move 14...Rxd1 15.Rxd1 Qxb2?? 16.Qa7 +- I guess doing 14.Rd1 as a quiet move (taking the d-file) is judged as taking a useless file because the heavy pieces disappear. Garding the b-pawn with 14.Nd3 is accepting that black stands better. With 14.Nd5 you are at least half a pawn up for nothing so I think this is a good test. Whether it is enough to win or not isn't so important as long as it is the best move and the engine have to see a little into it to get it. Odd Gunnar Odd Gunnar
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