Author: blass uri
Date: 12:36:04 01/16/99
Go up one level in this thread
On January 16, 1999 at 15:14:25, blass uri wrote: > >On January 16, 1999 at 15:03:33, Vincent Diepeveen wrote: > >>On January 15, 1999 at 08:48:28, Robert Hyatt wrote: >> >>>On January 15, 1999 at 02:26:01, Kai Skibbe wrote: >>> >>>>On January 14, 1999 at 22:55:15, Robert Hyatt wrote: >>>> >>>>>I'm willing to do most anything, but I have no idea what is needed, since >>>>>I don't know how they read the book, how their format looks, etc. IE it >>>>>seems odd to have a book algorithm that works perfectly well already built >>>>>into crafty and it can't use it... >>>> >>>>Hello Bob, >>>> >>>>why don´t you patch your winboard-engine to work with fritz ? The engine is >>>>already running with full tablebase-support and using the crafty-book. The major >>>>problem still is, that at every move the hashtables are cleared. But I think >>>>this problem could be solved easily. Roland Pfister, the author of Patzer, has >>>>already patched his code of his winboard-engine, so that the hashtables are not >>>>cleared. I think patzer reocognizes the "fritz"-command, which is send to the >>>>engine at the startup. >>>> >>>> >>>>Best regards >>>>Kai >>> >>>Firstly, I'm not a 'windows' programmer and don't know what has to be done to >>>work with the fritz API. Hash table clearing is only one problem that I have >>>described, but there are others. IE I carry lots of things from one search to >>>the next, from killer moves, to history counts, to the PV from the last search, >>>to the pawn hash stuff, and all of this gets wiped out when a bunch of moves >>>are 'stuffed' into crafty. >>> >>>I at least assume that the interface makes sure that both engines are not >>>'pondering' or using 'permanent brain' (same thing of course) as it is very >>>possible to turn it off in one, and leave it on in the other, and get some >>>nasty results... IE if crafty 'ponders' it does no good since the move list >>>gets stuffed in when the opponent moves. But it would certainly affect the >>>match because it would eat 50% of the cpu while the opponent was thinking, >>>and then throw that result away. So it would turn a PII/400 into a PII/200 >>>as far as the other program was concerned. And it would make a difference in >>>how things turned out. >>> >>>This is a mess, to say the least... >> >>Not really a mess. Chessbase spends time, so chessbase gets back result. >>That's how i see it. >> >>Their result is that other engines slowdown and suffer from the limited >>command set, with the result that they are twice as fast at the same >>computer when autoplaying there. That is a clear result. As matthias >>Feist is a very good programmer (just look how well interface actually is) >>we can only ASSUME it is done not by accident, but because it was demanded >>by someone. That someone is of course the one paying him. The one paying >>him is chessbase. >> >>It is simply a way to make fritz performance look better, that's how i >>see it. Of course what would you do? Crafty is freeware, fritz is >>a commercial program, so it is in their interest to do things in a >>way which by some can be seen as unfair. It's very doubtful whether it is >>unfair. If i tell this to a programmer then he says: unfair. >> >I do not think they earn by unfair things >I do not buy fritz5.32 before they do the real crafty(with tablebases and >without clearing the hash tables) an engine for Fritz5.32 > >Uri I also believe that the engines do not use permanent brain when they play one against the other. If they were using permanent brain then I could see in games between engines for Junior5 that one engine is at big depth after a few seconds and I did not see it. I can also say the engines not to use permanent brain in the engines parameters I assume that the bugs were done by accident also because I found other bugs that did not help them in their programs. I wait to hear if all the problems are solved. I understood that the problem of clearing the hash tables is solved. Uri
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