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Subject: Re: If hiarcs can port to mac ... what can users do to help this happen?

Author: ERIQ

Date: 19:06:46 01/07/05

Go up one level in this thread


On January 07, 2005 at 16:36:10, Richard A. Fowell wrote:

>On January 07, 2005 at 08:57:47, ERIQ wrote:
>
><snip>
>>
>>To date hiarcs, cm9000, deep sjeng and ruffian are the only commercial engines
>>available and two of the four are loosely supported at best ie. deep sjeng and
>>ruffian. Yet you make this list seem good ?!
>
>You are disappointed in a list that includes cm9000, deep sjeng and ruffian,
>and (soon now) a current version of HIARCS, and say "Yet you make this list seem
>good".
>
>How did you feel one year ago, when none of these engines were even prospective
>possibilities, and cm6000 and HIARCS 7 were the strongest chess programs on the
>Mac?
>
>Obviously, it isn't as nice as the list on the PC, and I would like to make it
>better.
>But it is heroicly better than it was a year ago.
>
>>Do you think mac and linux people would like to see other big names like:
>>shedder, fritz, junior, and chesstiger?
>
>Sure.
>
>I have been actively working for over a decade  to make that list better, and if
>you want to do
>something constructive to help me with that, I would welcome it. There are lots
>of things
>that users can do to help improve the chess software on their platform.
>
>Be very clear on one thing, though - it isn't that the programmers are lazy, it
>is that the rewards for putting their engines into the Mac market have been
>poor. The Chessbase database was on the Mac market for a while, then they
>stopped. HIARCS was on the Mac market in the late 90s for two versions, and then
>stopped. Chess software on the Mac just didn't return enough money to be worth
>the effort.
>
>Even when HIARCS (late 1990s) has head and shoulders the strongest chess program
>available for the Macintosh, it didn't make enough money to justify the effort.
>And that was despite a lot of unpaid effort on my part to help HIARCS succeed,
>including very extensive beta testing, writing chess software review articles in
>Inside Mac games, the BMUG and LAMG newsletters, GambitSoft and elsewhere,
>writing and distributing an unofficial patch to enhance HIARCS, and benchmarking
>HIARCS Mac vs. HIARCS PC to show that (for that version of HIARCS) the Mac was a
>faster platform for HIARCS than it seemed.
>
>So - what can we do to make it attractive to port good chess engines to the Mac?
>The classic economic approach is to lower the cost of putting good software on
>the Mac, and increase the return.
>
>One way of lowering the cost is to provide Mac OS/X host software that will take
>care of the GUI issues, such as Jose. Jose (http://jose-chess.sourceforge.net/)
>supports both X-board and UCI protocols, and I conjecture this is part of the
>reason that  Ruffian and Deep Sjeng are available as OS/X UCI engines currently.
>I think the current  work on Sigma Chess to support HIARCS through a UCI
>interface will help encourage more chess engines there as well.
>
>Another way to lower the cost of putting good software on the Mac is for users
>to volunteer to provide high-quality, unpaid testing as beta testers. By
>high-quality, I mean thorough test coverage of program features, testing on
>multiple configurations, narrowing down problems to specific, repeatable
>scenarios, and providing constructive, implementable suggestions for
>improvement. I have been doing that on the Mac and Palm OS for many authors, but
>this is one direct way to help improve the quality of the product. Many of the
>things that I as a user wanted in a chess program exist in MacChess because of
>the time I spent with the author testing the program and making suggestions and
>other contributions (such as creating a piece set).
>
>Now lets talk about the return side. There are relatively few Mac owners, of
>whom relatively few buy chess software, of whom relatively few buy HIARCS-class
>software, of which a relatively small fraction of the proceeds go to the
>programmer.
>
>Although I have influenced a few purchases, I can't imagine I've made much of an
>impact on the number of Mac owners, though I have done things such as join
>Macintosh user groups, provide free Mac consulting, purchase Macs at my company,
>and provide CD-Rs filled with hand-picked quality freeware and shareware as
>Christmas presents to every Mac owner I knew.
>
>As far as the fraction of Mac users who actually buy chess software, and high
>quality chess software, at that, I've tried to influence this through publicity.
>This includes writing chess software reviews for such magazines as Inside Mac
>Games, the BMUG newsletter, the LAMG newsletter, and an article in the past year
>in some Mac magazine I don't remember. I also make sure the authors are aware of
>the opportunities for free publicity offered by the Macintosh software indices
>offered by Apple, Versiontracker and the like.
>
>The real high-leverage point though, is the fraction of the money going to the
>computer programmers. As indicated in another post in this thread, the fraction
>of the proceeds that the chess engine programmer gets through the classic
>software distribution model is relatively small.
>
>One radical approach to changing this (as I mentioned in the other message)
>would be to get a co-op effort to commission the port of a chess engine. That
>way the fraction of what you as a user pay goes to incentivize the chess engine
>programmer is much higher.
>
>So - what can you do to help change this situation?

  I can Let all programmers know that it would be more profitable to just make
engine as xboard and uci for all three major platforms winblows, palm, unix-like
systems (freebsd,linux and apple) and then distibute it themselfs via a webpage
keeping most of the profits. I for one would find no problem buying an engine
for $30 directly from an authors webpage and then downloading my favorite free
gui to play it with. What is so hard about this? I am sure they are not making
$30 an engine at the moment!
>-Richard



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