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Subject: Re: Did GM Michael Adams 2737 honestly lose?

Author: Rolf Tueschen

Date: 03:57:21 06/27/05

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On June 26, 2005 at 21:11:02, Mark Young wrote:

>On June 26, 2005 at 21:06:15, Rolf Tueschen wrote:
>
>>On June 26, 2005 at 20:03:28, Mark Young wrote:
>>
>>>On June 26, 2005 at 18:54:24, Rolf Tueschen wrote:
>>>
>>>>On June 26, 2005 at 18:08:49, Mark Young wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On June 26, 2005 at 16:25:35, Rolf Tueschen wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On June 26, 2005 at 15:02:56, I Hart SanQuentin wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On June 26, 2005 at 14:27:44, stuart taylor wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>No, of cause not! Not enough games! It needs atLEAST 500 games between the two
>>>>>>>>to get a rough idea.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>S.Taylor
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>No not 500 games a 1,275,326 games otherwise there is no likelyhood that the
>>>>>>>comp is better than mickey, it was just the most amazing streak of bad luck you
>>>>>>>ever saw that he is down 4.5 to .5
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>In case you made ironic remarks let me state that indeed such a result does not
>>>>>>mean anything (in reality and also in statistics). You dont believe me? Well,
>>>>>>remember the match between JUNIOR and FRITZ a couple of years ago. JUNIOR was
>>>>>>clearly leading and FRITZ still won the match. In short: 6 games is nothing
>>>>>>relevant.
>>>>>
>>>>>As you most likely know. It is not just the number of games. It is the score
>>>>>that also must be considered. The closer the score the more games that are
>>>>>needed to show which player is really stronger.
>>>>>
>>>>>If GM Adams draws tomorrows game, and the score ends 5-1 for Hydra. There is a
>>>>>almost a 90% certainty that Hydra was stronger then GM Adams. Who is #7 in the
>>>>>world.
>>>>>
>>>>>If GM Adam loses, then we can say with even higher certainty then 90%. That
>>>>>Hydra is stronger then GM Adams. IF Hydra loses tomorrow with a 4.5 - 1.5
>>>>>winning score for Hydra, I agree. The results are nothing relevant. Meaning you
>>>>>could not say that Hydra is stronger then GM Adams with any kind of great
>>>>>certainty.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Mark, you are wrong with your statement. For 6 games any score is without
>>>>relevant meaning. You cant assume any certainty with 6 games. But of course
>>>>score means something and you need less games for a clear score. Again, dont you
>>>>remember the famous qualification match in Cadaques between JUNIOR and FRITZ?
>>>>JUNIOR led by 4-0 or was it 5-0? FRITZ still won.
>>>>
>>>>But honestly in case of Adams I wouldn't expect anything in his favour. :)
>>>
>>>I am sorry.... I gave that stats, and they are correct. With a draw tomorrow you
>>>can say with 90% confidence that Hydra is better then GM Adams. That means a 1
>>>in 10 chance,  GM Adams my be better then Hydra. With a win tomorrow for Hydra
>>>the chances are even lower for GM Adams.  GM Adams must win tomorrow for this
>>>match to not have much meaning.
>>>
>>>You can accept this or reject it.....be the stats are correct.
>>
>>
>>No. You forget about the combination of the two factors score and number of
>>games.
>
>I am sorry again, but you are incorrect. To calculate the stats. You must have
>the number of games, and the score. The stats are the stats.

Yes. And that is why 6 games mean nothing in statistics. Understood? & games
mean nothing no matter of the score. But you claimed that a 5.5 vs 0.5 would be
relevant. Significant. etc. I told you it is NOT. And the reason is here the
little number of games. Period.


>
>As I said before. The stats are correct, but I see you want to reject the
>stats....



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