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Subject: Re: La Petite 1.0 (download)

Author: Robert Hyatt

Date: 20:18:32 10/24/99

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On October 24, 1999 at 16:02:34, Frank Schneider wrote:

>On October 24, 1999 at 10:08:45, Robert Hyatt wrote:
>
>>On October 24, 1999 at 05:59:40, Frank Schneider wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>I haven't tried the 'strings lapetite.exe', but I believe you that there are
>>>lots of strings that were just translated. I agree that is strong evidence
>>>that lapetite's I/O is based on Crafty. But is there any evidence that the
>>>engine is still a crafty clone?
>>>
>>>Copying an engine is, from my point of view, much worse than reusing the
>>>I/O stuff and structure of the userinterface.
>>>
>>
>>Run the second test I mentioned:  start "La Petite" under a debugger, and
>>look for the area where all the 64 bit masks are in memory.  You will find
>>patterns like 80000000 00000000, 40000000 00000000, 20000000 00000000, etc.
>>then look for the rotated masks which are like the above, but in a different
>>order (64 bits, 1 bit set).  Then compare to crafty.exe.  Look at data.c to
>>find the pre-initialized scoring array patterns.  See if you can find 'em in
>>La Petite.  :)
>>
>>etc.
>I don't have La Petite.
>
>But I have very similar bit masks in Gromit (only 16 bit, because Gromit
>does not use bitboards) and I wonder how to write a bitboard-base program
>without such bit masks. Is there anything special about the order of masks
>in Crafty that is unlikely to be invented independently by others?

there are 64 of the masks that are just 1 bit shifted right slowly but surely.
I can't imagine why you would have such masks (notice that they are each 64
bits long) if you aren't doing bitmaps.  I have another set that has one bit
set in each 64 bit value, but the bit isn't in the 'sliding' pattern, as it is
used to update the rotated-left-90-degree board.  Another set of 64 for each
of the two 45-degree-rotated boards.  Those are pretty unique to my style of
rotating...  There are many other masks as well, including the compact-attacks
array of values that _nobody_ would likely have without using the crafty engine
(this was the code done by Mark Bromley).



>
>Do other bit board based programs use such masks? How do they look in
>Inmichess? Insomniac (if it uses bit boards)?

any bitboard program probably has the 64 masks with the sliding 1, but the
other 3 sets are very unlikely, and the compact-attack stuff is probably
impossible to reproduce exactly without copying, as there are so many
different ways to do the same thing.




>
>I agree that it is something different if LaPetite uses the same scoring arrays.
>Everyone uses them, but finding lots of identical scores would be surprising.
>
>
>I'd really like to see a statement here, where G. Mueller gives her point
>of view.
>
>
>Frank


So would I.  Because it is so blatant.  But G. Mueller didn't discuss voyager
a year ago when she burst upon the scene with a program stronger than almost
any new amateur, complete with parallel search...  I doubt we will hear anything
now...



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