Author: Robert Hyatt
Date: 19:57:55 01/09/00
Go up one level in this thread
On January 09, 2000 at 19:27:02, Bruce Moreland wrote: >On January 09, 2000 at 18:40:34, Amir Ban wrote: > >>On January 09, 2000 at 18:21:53, James Robertson wrote: >> >>>> >>>>Why Shredder ? I read it twice and I haven't got a clue (except that he's your >>>>friend). >>>> >>>>Amir >>> >>>I think Bruce's words were an overstatement; there is nothing specifically >>>against Shredder there. >>> >>>But that fact that it is never mentioned Shredder won the WCCC is telling >>>enough. >>> >>>James >> >>Actually it is mentioned. Both Shredder 2 and Shredder 4 are discussed, with a >>mention of both their world titles. >> >>On the other hand, Hiarcs and Junior, two former world champions, are mentioned >>derisively as Fritz accessories, with no mention of their titles, or anything >>else for that matter. I would have loved to read a protest by Bruce on this >>account. >> >>I think Stefan MK has a fine program, but you have to be pretty biased to read >>here a specific attack on Shredder. >> >>Amir > >You are a really tough programmer with a really tough program, and it bothers me >that when my program plays your program I feel like I have less than a 50% >chance to win. If that comes through, I'm sorry. I don't know if you think >that I expressed this via my comments about the Kasparov vs IBM thing, but in >that case I argued what I thought was right, and it's not like I'm a big fan of >IBM, after all I believe that I accused them (the company) of wrecking computer >chess. I just don't think they cheated in the match. > >You are right though, Junior and Hiarcs are mentioned as Fritz accessories. > >I also overreacted to the comment about Shredder. I will explain what in the >heck I was talking about. > >After the 1996 tournament I heard that Shredder had been subjected to reviews >that essentially stated: Shredder is weak, it was lucky to win in a diminished >field, don't buy Shredder. I heard about these second hand because I don't >subscribe to the European computer chess magazines. > >At the 1999 Paderborn WCCC I watched as Shredder was seeded 12th, behind some >programs that it had previously beaten individually and finished ahead of in the >standings. It proceeded to win the tournament on inferior hardware. At the >time I heard that people were declaring that its high showing was due to "luck" >in the endgame, the implicit points being that 1) this "luck" diminishes the >truth of the result, and 2) a real program should club its opponents to death in >the middlegame, and therefore it is somehow unsporting to draw the game out and >win by a late tactical trick or whatever. > >So that's how I took Cock's comment about Shredder's endgame play. Perhaps I am >reading more into that than I should, so I retract that portion of my comment. >I now claim that the article is merely a hack job on Crafty. > >bruce The "author" probably has an axe to grind with me. At the time of the great "bionic fiasco" several programmers, including Vincent, asked me to contact him and suggest that Bionic not be allowed to play. He didn't like the advice, as he was friends with the group (or some of the group) with Bionic. He probably also doesn't like my expose on La Petite or Voyager either. I had originally thought it might have been statements by Kasparov. Now I see that they are statements by someone that 'doesn't count' at all. I am much less bothered by it now.
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